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surprised by the looting ?

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kbarr
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PostPosted: 09/04/05 - 20:16    Post subject: Reply with quote

Soriak wrote:
Kbarr wrote:
Soriak wrote:
Quote:
No I wouldn't go loot shit, I'm better than that sorry.


Sorry, I don't buy that.

If you could steal $1,000,000 without fear of repercussion and without causing the owner financial (and physical) harm, almost everyone would do it. We'd like to believe we wouldn't, but it just depends on how far we have to go. (most people wouldn't do it at gunpoint, but if all you have to do is grab it...)

Now try to keep in mind that those thieves lost their homes and their property - if they had a job, chances are they won't anymore. So, no money and no hope - all could be fixed by grabbing some jewelry that is insured anyway. Is it legal? nope. Is it understandable?


Idiot.

Socialist.


What does this have to do with socialism? Of course you don't see wealthy people looting - they were able to afford insurance and thus won't be off (much) worse after this. This is an issue that only affects poor people, which (surprisingly) are the ones doing the looting.

And that jewelry store isn't off any worse than before the hurrican, they most certainly had insurance.


Also, how many people on TV have you seen being concerned about food and water? How many about their future? I'd think when you see everything destroyed, the first thoughts aren't how you're going to survive the week, but the uncertainty of your entire future. Everything you had, everything you knew - gone.


Idiot.

Socialist.

What exactly is your mushy point?





That you personally would be looting if a hurricane surrounded your home with water? That you would be looting if your house was destroyed?


Looting is taking anything that is not for IMMEDIATE use in prolonging life.


Stacks of sneakers and carts with TVs is looting. Taking food water and clothing to wear is not.


So, just to clear this up. If your house was destroyed you would have no problem in walking across the street to your neighbor who was smart enough to leave and take their shit before they get back?

Thats ok?

Acceptable? Remember, you might be poor.

Its ok to take someone elses shit because you lost your own shit?

I see how you think.

You socialist.
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Soriak
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PostPosted: 09/04/05 - 21:17    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kbarr wrote:
Soriak wrote:
Kbarr wrote:
Soriak wrote:
Quote:
No I wouldn't go loot shit, I'm better than that sorry.


Sorry, I don't buy that.

If you could steal $1,000,000 without fear of repercussion and without causing the owner financial (and physical) harm, almost everyone would do it. We'd like to believe we wouldn't, but it just depends on how far we have to go. (most people wouldn't do it at gunpoint, but if all you have to do is grab it...)

Now try to keep in mind that those thieves lost their homes and their property - if they had a job, chances are they won't anymore. So, no money and no hope - all could be fixed by grabbing some jewelry that is insured anyway. Is it legal? nope. Is it understandable?


Idiot.

Socialist.


What does this have to do with socialism? Of course you don't see wealthy people looting - they were able to afford insurance and thus won't be off (much) worse after this. This is an issue that only affects poor people, which (surprisingly) are the ones doing the looting.

And that jewelry store isn't off any worse than before the hurrican, they most certainly had insurance.


Also, how many people on TV have you seen being concerned about food and water? How many about their future? I'd think when you see everything destroyed, the first thoughts aren't how you're going to survive the week, but the uncertainty of your entire future. Everything you had, everything you knew - gone.


Idiot.

Socialist.

What exactly is your mushy point?





That you personally would be looting if a hurricane surrounded your home with water? That you would be looting if your house was destroyed?


Looting is taking anything that is not for IMMEDIATE use in prolonging life.


Stacks of sneakers and carts with TVs is looting. Taking food water and clothing to wear is not.


So, just to clear this up. If your house was destroyed you would have no problem in walking across the street to your neighbor who was smart enough to leave and take their shit before they get back?

Thats ok?

Acceptable? Remember, you might be poor.

Its ok to take someone elses shit because you lost your own shit?

I see how you think.

You socialist.


Me personally? Nope, I have insurance. If everything is gone, I get a flat amount high enough to replace everything. I could leave, knowing no matter what happened, I'd be ok when I got back. (Until insurance pays, I could use other savings - also an option the poor people who remained behind don't have)

There's also a difference between stealing from someone's house and stealing from a jewelry store. The latter is guaranteed to have insurance and get every last cent of it back - he doesn't lose anything.


Do you think anyone is going to walk past a jewelry store with broken windows and say "oh wow, I just lost everything I have and this could instantly fix it. There's no repercussion for taking it, but I'm a good citizen, so I'll just keep walking. I wouldn't want to inconvenience the owner, who had to report the theft to his insurance to get the money back."
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kbarr
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PostPosted: 09/04/05 - 21:34    Post subject: Reply with quote

Soriak wrote:




Me personally? Nope, I have insurance. If everything is gone, I get a flat amount high enough to replace everything. I could leave, knowing no matter what happened, I'd be ok when I got back. (Until insurance pays, I could use other savings - also an option the poor people who remained behind don't have)

There's also a difference between stealing from someone's house and stealing from a jewelry store. The latter is guaranteed to have insurance and get every last cent of it back - he doesn't lose anything.


Do you think anyone is going to walk past a jewelry store with broken windows and say "oh wow, I just lost everything I have and this could instantly fix it. There's no repercussion for taking it, but I'm a good citizen, so I'll just keep walking. I wouldn't want to inconvenience the owner, who had to report the theft to his insurance to get the money back."


You side stepped.

You idiot.
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Brael
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PostPosted: 09/05/05 - 01:40    Post subject: Reply with quote

Soriak wrote:
Do you think anyone is going to walk past a jewelry store with broken windows and say "oh wow, I just lost everything I have and this could instantly fix it. There's no repercussion for taking it, but I'm a good citizen, so I'll just keep walking. I wouldn't want to inconvenience the owner, who had to report the theft to his insurance to get the money back."


I would, it's called being honest.
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Galdaria
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PostPosted: 09/05/05 - 03:04    Post subject: Reply with quote

Even if the store is insured, who in the f**k do you think pays those insurance premiums? Who's rates will increase? Seriously, do you think these insurance companies have money trees growing in their cement gardens? Stealing it from a jewelry store or someones home is no different. It is stealing and eventually comes out of our pockets.
Pull your head from your anus please.

Not to even begin to mention the ever swift and well aimed negative karma you would suffer. For every action, there is a reaction. Humans believe this doesnt apply to them.
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Eindar
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PostPosted: 09/05/05 - 04:43    Post subject: Reply with quote

Brael wrote:
Soriak wrote:
Do you think anyone is going to walk past a jewelry store with broken windows and say "oh wow, I just lost everything I have and this could instantly fix it. There's no repercussion for taking it, but I'm a good citizen, so I'll just keep walking. I wouldn't want to inconvenience the owner, who had to report the theft to his insurance to get the money back."


I would, it's called being honest.


Wow, you just lied about being honest.

Temptation is a b***h, and that's when you've got a nice warm home to go back to. You're obviously having trouble putting yourself in their shoes, or you've likely got a nice fat savings account that will be there, flood or no flood. These people have NOTHING. Yes, they need food and water now, but they're gonna need food and water later, too. Now, how can you tell the stupid looters from the smart ones? The guys hauling off TVs and crates full of sneakers are stupid. They MUST evacuate, and they're not going to let them on the bus with their 40" plasma. The smart looters will have taken jewelry, which can be hidden underneath clothes and used at pawn shops when they arrive in Houston to secure cash which will be used to purchase lodging and meals for the next, oh, 2-6 months. In fact, I'd say THOSE looters are smarter than you in that situation.

Would I shoot or get shot over some jewelry? No.

Would I raid the Wal-Mart for Xbox games? No.

If there was a highly portable, easily liquidated asset that is also easily obtainable, and I have no money, and no way of obtaining any once I reach my final destination, would I grab as much as possible? You bet your ass.
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kbarr
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PostPosted: 09/05/05 - 05:41    Post subject: Reply with quote

Eindar wrote:
Brael wrote:
Soriak wrote:
Do you think anyone is going to walk past a jewelry store with broken windows and say "oh wow, I just lost everything I have and this could instantly fix it. There's no repercussion for taking it, but I'm a good citizen, so I'll just keep walking. I wouldn't want to inconvenience the owner, who had to report the theft to his insurance to get the money back."


I would, it's called being honest.


Wow, you just lied about being honest.

Temptation is a b***h, and that's when you've got a nice warm home to go back to. You're obviously having trouble putting yourself in their shoes, or you've likely got a nice fat savings account that will be there, flood or no flood. These people have NOTHING. Yes, they need food and water now, but they're gonna need food and water later, too. Now, how can you tell the stupid looters from the smart ones? The guys hauling off TVs and crates full of sneakers are stupid. They MUST evacuate, and they're not going to let them on the bus with their 40" plasma. The smart looters will have taken jewelry, which can be hidden underneath clothes and used at pawn shops when they arrive in Houston to secure cash which will be used to purchase lodging and meals for the next, oh, 2-6 months. In fact, I'd say THOSE looters are smarter than you in that situation.

Would I shoot or get shot over some jewelry? No.

Would I raid the Wal-Mart for Xbox games? No.

If there was a highly portable, easily liquidated asset that is also easily obtainable, and I have no money, and no way of obtaining any once I reach my final destination, would I grab as much as possible? You bet your ass.



Thats cool.

Just remember, if there was someone there like me guarding it, you would get shot.

Cool
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Brael
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PostPosted: 09/05/05 - 07:17    Post subject: Reply with quote

What makes you so sure I'm lying? I simply don't believe in stealing shit unless it's a necessity for survival (hi food/water in grocery stores). Jewelry isn't a necessity unless you're a black rapper flashing his bling before he gets shot.
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Soriak
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PostPosted: 09/05/05 - 08:51    Post subject: Reply with quote

Galdaria wrote:
Even if the store is insured, who in the f**k do you think pays those insurance premiums? Who's rates will increase? Seriously, do you think these insurance companies have money trees growing in their cement gardens? Stealing it from a jewelry store or someones home is no different. It is stealing and eventually comes out of our pockets.
Pull your head from your anus please.

Not to even begin to mention the ever swift and well aimed negative karma you would suffer. For every action, there is a reaction. Humans believe this doesnt apply to them.


Insurance premium isn't going to skyrocket if a jewelry store got robbed in a natural disaster... it's not like the insurers didn't already know the place to be at a higher risk than you're average store. A jewelry store here got robbed 4 times or so in the last 3 years - you'd think they hired a security guard by now, but nope. I suppose insurance premium STILL isn't high enough to make such an addition worthwhile.

Besides, I'm sure the owner is glad someone stole it. Much easier to get the money and buy new inventory, than clean every item and hope it didn't get damaged. If I were him, I'd get out of NO too - not like he'll have many customers there in the near future...
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PostPosted: 09/05/05 - 09:57    Post subject: Reply with quote

Soriak wrote:
. A jewelry store here got robbed 4 times or so in the last 3 years - you'd think they hired a security guard by now, but nope.


good way to liquidate inventory : )


BTW i doubt any jewelery stores got jobbed , you can put an entire stores inventory in one briefcase . I'm sure they didn't just leave it there .
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PostPosted: 09/05/05 - 11:23    Post subject: Reply with quote

Soriak wrote:
There's also a difference between stealing from someone's house and stealing from a jewelry store. The latter is guaranteed to have insurance and get every last cent of it back - he doesn't lose anything.



Ok, so it's ok to steal whatever you want from businesses because they have insurance. Gotcha.










































d*****s.
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motherface
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PostPosted: 09/05/05 - 11:26    Post subject: Reply with quote

Brash wrote:
Soriak wrote:
. A jewelry store here got robbed 4 times or so in the last 3 years - you'd think they hired a security guard by now, but nope.


good way to liquidate inventory : )


BTW i doubt any jewelery stores got jobbed , you can put an entire stores inventory in one briefcase . I'm sure they didn't just leave it there .


Even if it was on premises, jewelry stores don't leave their stuff on display overnight in case they... dum dum dum... get robbed. I imagine they all have vaults or safes.
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kbarr
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PostPosted: 09/05/05 - 12:58    Post subject: Reply with quote

Soriak wrote:
Galdaria wrote:
Even if the store is insured, who in the f**k do you think pays those insurance premiums? Who's rates will increase? Seriously, do you think these insurance companies have money trees growing in their cement gardens? Stealing it from a jewelry store or someones home is no different. It is stealing and eventually comes out of our pockets.
Pull your head from your anus please.

Not to even begin to mention the ever swift and well aimed negative karma you would suffer. For every action, there is a reaction. Humans believe this doesnt apply to them.


Insurance premium isn't going to skyrocket if a jewelry store got robbed in a natural disaster... it's not like the insurers didn't already know the place to be at a higher risk than you're average store. A jewelry store here got robbed 4 times or so in the last 3 years - you'd think they hired a security guard by now, but nope. I suppose insurance premium STILL isn't high enough to make such an addition worthwhile.

Besides, I'm sure the owner is glad someone stole it. Much easier to get the money and buy new inventory, than clean every item and hope it didn't get damaged. If I were him, I'd get out of NO too - not like he'll have many customers there in the near future...


Idiot.

Socialist.
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Soriak
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PostPosted: 09/05/05 - 13:03    Post subject: Reply with quote

motherface wrote:
Soriak wrote:
There's also a difference between stealing from someone's house and stealing from a jewelry store. The latter is guaranteed to have insurance and get every last cent of it back - he doesn't lose anything.



Ok, so it's ok to steal whatever you want from businesses because they have insurance. Gotcha.

d*****s.


This isn't a legal discussion - of course it's not "ok" and of course no one would say "but your honor, the guy had insurance!!"

We're talking about understandable actions in a crisis.
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kbarr
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PostPosted: 09/05/05 - 13:08    Post subject: Reply with quote

Soriak wrote:
motherface wrote:
Soriak wrote:
There's also a difference between stealing from someone's house and stealing from a jewelry store. The latter is guaranteed to have insurance and get every last cent of it back - he doesn't lose anything.



Ok, so it's ok to steal whatever you want from businesses because they have insurance. Gotcha.

d*****s.


This isn't a legal discussion - of course it's not "ok" and of course no one would say "but your honor, the guy had insurance!!"

We're talking about understandable actions in a crisis.


To a stupid socialist like you.

Here, we shoot looters.
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Brash
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PostPosted: 09/05/05 - 13:12    Post subject: Reply with quote

everyone here can walk the high moral ground now but faced with a realistic threat that their children are going to starve to death or be forced to drink disease ridden water, their tunes will change dramatically.

your child's crying eyes can make you do allot of things you might never do otherwise.
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Scrabler
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PostPosted: 09/05/05 - 13:37    Post subject: Reply with quote

Brash wrote:
everyone here can walk the high moral ground now but faced with a realistic threat that their children are going to starve to death or be forced to drink disease ridden water, their tunes will change dramatically.

your child's crying eyes can make you do allot of things you might never do otherwise.


How is taking anything besides food and water going to keep your kid alive?
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Frax
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PostPosted: 09/05/05 - 13:47    Post subject: Reply with quote

Brash wrote:
everyone here can walk the high moral ground now but faced with a realistic threat that their children are going to starve to death or be forced to drink disease ridden water, their tunes will change dramatically.

your child's crying eyes can make you do allot of things you might never do otherwise.


Very few if anyone is 'starving to death' at this point. Maybe some older folks and people unable to leave. Judging by the amount of FOOD TRASH at all of these 'third world refugee camps', I'd say the people who were 'stuck' in new orleans were eating ok. You can easily live an entire week without food if healthy, and most people could survive two weeks. Hell, Terry Schiavo last 13 days. It's been. omg, 7 whole days.

The 'human misery' side of this story is bad, however it's not nearly as bad as the news media is making it out to be.
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PostPosted: 09/05/05 - 13:47    Post subject: Reply with quote

Scrabler wrote:
Brash wrote:
everyone here can walk the high moral ground now but faced with a realistic threat that their children are going to starve to death or be forced to drink disease ridden water, their tunes will change dramatically.

your child's crying eyes can make you do allot of things you might never do otherwise.


How is taking anything besides food and water going to keep your kid alive?


not everyone was taking lawnmowers and cameras . The people who were thieves before the disaster most certainly took advantage of the disaster and did though. Most thieves are opportunists. Thieves also happen to generally be poor and in the lower classes of society (precisely the people we left behind) You should not be surprised that these thieves choose to take advantage of the moment and steel shit.

you are just abusing this to support your racist ideas.
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Brash
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PostPosted: 09/05/05 - 13:59    Post subject: Reply with quote

Frax wrote:
Brash wrote:
everyone here can walk the high moral ground now but faced with a realistic threat that their children are going to starve to death or be forced to drink disease ridden water, their tunes will change dramatically.

your child's crying eyes can make you do allot of things you might never do otherwise.


Very few if anyone is 'starving to death' at this point. Maybe some older folks and people unable to leave. Judging by the amount of FOOD TRASH at all of these 'third world refugee camps', I'd say the people who were 'stuck' in new orleans were eating ok. You can easily live an entire week without food if healthy, and most people could survive two weeks. Hell, Terry Schiavo last 13 days. It's been. omg, 7 whole days.

The 'human misery' side of this story is bad, however it's not nearly as bad as the news media is making it out to be.



reality is people didn't know what was going to happen . all they knew was the whole city was demolished and they have no idea when help was coming ? If you wait till you actually "need" the supplies you will have none because everyone else will have already taken them. Yes you can live a long time without food but how long are you willing to give your daughter water filled with sewage ? besides the point the stores shelves were going to be cleaned out regardless if you got water and food for your family. if you choose not to then the store is still empty the only difference is you all go hungry and have to explain why the water you are giving your daughter smells like p**s. The only impact that was made is in your head.

anyways, you can all say what you want now but until some disaster happens to you and you have to make hard choices like these, you will never really know what you would do and how you will weigh your ethics with your families lives. i think most of you walking the moral high ground now would be surprised at what you are capable of if you thought it was a real life or death situation for you and your children.


Last edited by Brash on 09/05/05 - 14:03; edited 1 time in total
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moot
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PostPosted: 09/05/05 - 14:01    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://edition.cnn.com/video/player/player.html?url=/video/bestoftv/2005/09/03/lkl.celine.dion.cnn


celion says let them touch pants!
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PostPosted: 09/05/05 - 14:12    Post subject: Reply with quote

moot wrote:
http://edition.cnn.com/video/player/player.html?url=/video/bestoftv/2005/09/03/lkl.celine.dion.cnn


What a stupid b***h.
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IceIsFun
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PostPosted: 09/05/05 - 14:20    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pags wrote:
moot wrote:
http://edition.cnn.com/video/player/player.html?url=/video/bestoftv/2005/09/03/lkl.celine.dion.cnn


What a stupid b***h.


Haha, is she signing or what?
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Pags
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PostPosted: 09/05/05 - 14:28    Post subject: Reply with quote

lol, just watch the video. I had to close it after a minute.
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PostPosted: 09/05/05 - 15:22    Post subject: Reply with quote

Eindar wrote:
Brael wrote:
Soriak wrote:
Do you think anyone is going to walk past a jewelry store with broken windows and say "oh wow, I just lost everything I have and this could instantly fix it. There's no repercussion for taking it, but I'm a good citizen, so I'll just keep walking. I wouldn't want to inconvenience the owner, who had to report the theft to his insurance to get the money back."


I would, it's called being honest.


Wow, you just lied about being honest.

Temptation is a b***h, and that's when you've got a nice warm home to go back to. You're obviously having trouble putting yourself in their shoes, or you've likely got a nice fat savings account that will be there, flood or no flood. These people have NOTHING. Yes, they need food and water now, but they're gonna need food and water later, too. Now, how can you tell the stupid looters from the smart ones? The guys hauling off TVs and crates full of sneakers are stupid. They MUST evacuate, and they're not going to let them on the bus with their 40" plasma. The smart looters will have taken jewelry, which can be hidden underneath clothes and used at pawn shops when they arrive in Houston to secure cash which will be used to purchase lodging and meals for the next, oh, 2-6 months. In fact, I'd say THOSE looters are smarter than you in that situation.

Would I shoot or get shot over some jewelry? No.

Would I raid the Wal-Mart for Xbox games? No.

If there was a highly portable, easily liquidated asset that is also easily obtainable, and I have no money, and no way of obtaining any once I reach my final destination, would I grab as much as possible? You bet your ass.


If you want to be honest about yourself then fine, but don't try to categorize everyone else under your own beliefs. Thats just selfish. As I stated earlier, if I were in the situation, the thought of looting would not even be an option because I guarantee you theres enough help needed over there to keep you busy for months.
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PostPosted: 09/05/05 - 15:48    Post subject: Reply with quote

Soriak wrote:
This isn't a legal discussion - of course it's not "ok" and of course no one would say "but your honor, the guy had insurance!!"

We're talking about understandable actions in a crisis.


I can't believe you're rationalizing looting. These people aren't just stealing food and water and toiletries, they're taking anything they can get their hands on.
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PostPosted: 09/05/05 - 15:57    Post subject: Reply with quote

Brash wrote:
not everyone was taking lawnmowers and cameras .


I don't think anybody gives a shit about the people who are taking food and water, so what are you blabbering about?
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Eindar
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PostPosted: 09/05/05 - 16:02    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tura wrote:
Eindar wrote:
Brael wrote:
Soriak wrote:
Do you think anyone is going to walk past a jewelry store with broken windows and say "oh wow, I just lost everything I have and this could instantly fix it. There's no repercussion for taking it, but I'm a good citizen, so I'll just keep walking. I wouldn't want to inconvenience the owner, who had to report the theft to his insurance to get the money back."


I would, it's called being honest.


Wow, you just lied about being honest.

Temptation is a b***h, and that's when you've got a nice warm home to go back to. You're obviously having trouble putting yourself in their shoes, or you've likely got a nice fat savings account that will be there, flood or no flood. These people have NOTHING. Yes, they need food and water now, but they're gonna need food and water later, too. Now, how can you tell the stupid looters from the smart ones? The guys hauling off TVs and crates full of sneakers are stupid. They MUST evacuate, and they're not going to let them on the bus with their 40" plasma. The smart looters will have taken jewelry, which can be hidden underneath clothes and used at pawn shops when they arrive in Houston to secure cash which will be used to purchase lodging and meals for the next, oh, 2-6 months. In fact, I'd say THOSE looters are smarter than you in that situation.

Would I shoot or get shot over some jewelry? No.

Would I raid the Wal-Mart for Xbox games? No.

If there was a highly portable, easily liquidated asset that is also easily obtainable, and I have no money, and no way of obtaining any once I reach my final destination, would I grab as much as possible? You bet your ass.


If you want to be honest about yourself then fine, but don't try to categorize everyone else under your own beliefs. Thats just selfish. As I stated earlier, if I were in the situation, the thought of looting would not even be an option because I guarantee you theres enough help needed over there to keep you busy for months.


You're falling into the same fallacy. You're putting Tura on the street, who has an education, and a comfortable lifestyle. You have no reason to steal, because when you get out of the hellhole of New Orleans, you will pull out your debit card and get the supplies you need.

90% of these buys were barely making ends meet before the hurricane. Now they have NOTHING, and no way to get anything for the next 6 months. For the ones stealing easily liquidated, portable assets, this isn't about survival now, it's about survival later.

The idiots stealing Saints jerseys and microwaves can rot in hell, though, they're just plain old idiots Smile
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PostPosted: 09/05/05 - 16:25    Post subject: Reply with quote

Eindar wrote:

... 90% of these ...


hooray for factual internet statistics!
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Brael
RealPoor Guru
RealPoor Guru


Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 2122



PostPosted: 09/05/05 - 16:54    Post subject: Reply with quote

Brash, no one cares about the people taking food/water, you keep confusing that with people going around looting tv's, shoes, jewelry, watches, etc...

Eindar, I've been in situations similar to those people before so I'm pretty damn sure I know what I would do. Just because you would contribute to society breaking down in that case doesn't mean everyone would.
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