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FockTop
Sir Postalot
Joined: 23 Dec 2004
Posts: 1055
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 Posted: 01/22/06 - 17:07 Post subject: Vanguard
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Anyone plan to play it?
http://www.vanguardsoh.com/
Seems like it will be exactly what EQ was before brad left meaning just like it was for EQ/kurnak/velious.
All I hope for : Good death penalty hell like EQ was at the start you die you yell THAT was fun.
No f*****g PVP , PVP = Kid invasion.
I want some damn challenge!
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myndwarrp
Can't Stop Posting
Joined: 27 Jan 2004
Posts: 637
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Posted: 01/22/06 - 18:09 Post subject:
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me gonna play...I hope Brad deosnt let us down 
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Are you skilled mage or a hardboiled warrior in search for most suitable guild to join?
Or if you're already guild member ready to share some real PvP experience…
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khrath
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 8750
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Posted: 01/22/06 - 18:59 Post subject:
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There is a reason WoW has decimated EQ, and EQ2's subscriber bases
Dieing isn't a big deal
PVP
If it goes like you suggest, I won't even play
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Finigan
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 3817
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Posted: 01/22/06 - 19:20 Post subject:
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| khrath wrote: | There is a reason WoW has decimated EQ, and EQ2's subscriber bases
Dieing isn't a big deal
PVP
If it goes like you suggest, I won't even play |
Hmm that works for some people, but I quit WoW because when I was playing, other than doing MC/Onyxia the only thing to do was pvp which I hated.
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kireol
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 02 Aug 2003
Posts: 9517
Location: Royal Oak, MI
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Posted: 01/22/06 - 19:32 Post subject:
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I think it works for 6X the people. or so say the subscription base.
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goatface
Sir Postalot
Joined: 12 Oct 2002
Posts: 1354
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Posted: 01/22/06 - 19:57 Post subject:
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while i didn't alway like the death system in eq
i think it made the game better (than what is in wow or daoc)
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FockTop
Sir Postalot
Joined: 23 Dec 2004
Posts: 1055
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Posted: 01/22/06 - 20:09 Post subject:
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A good penalty system pretty the game from being invaved by kids.
trust me no 13-16 years old would stay in a game is they lose exp and maybe a level when they die. And it makes stupid people leave the game.
EQ prior Luclin was far superior to WoW in every single way for me.
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khrath
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 8750
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Posted: 01/22/06 - 21:33 Post subject:
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| FockTop wrote: | | trust me no 13-16 years old would stay in a game is they lose exp and maybe a level when they die. And it makes stupid people leave the game. |
That'd make everyone leave the game
Why would a char get weaker because they were defeated?
It's retanded
There's no reasoning to it
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Grizmaster
Banned Scammer
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Posts: 377
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Posted: 01/22/06 - 21:52 Post subject:
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| FockTop wrote: |
EQ prior Luclin was far superior to WoW in every single way for me. |
Agreed, I liked the beastlord class that was added with the Luclin expansion, but that's all I really liked about the expansion.
Vanguard better dang well have a penalty for death, it'll keep everyone on their toes and risk factor goes up with it, I find it to make things more interesting and fun.
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Zuldane
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 4057
Location: At sea.
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Posted: 01/22/06 - 22:01 Post subject:
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How is the beta looking?
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r00typooh
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 5178
Location: Miami, FL
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Posted: 01/22/06 - 22:34 Post subject:
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i can't wait for vanguard. i <3 brad in a completly straight way
brad makes games for the hardcore gamer not for the masses like every other MMO out there and even EQ since he and his team left.
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Domination
Can't Stop Posting
Joined: 13 Oct 2002
Posts: 565
Location: Atlanta, GA
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Posted: 01/22/06 - 22:45 Post subject:
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| Zuldane wrote: | | How is the beta looking? |
They did another big round of invites the other day so there is like 150-200 people online now instead of 50-100. I haven't played an extreme amount but about 4-6 total hours over the past few weeks and from what i see its gotten alot better pretty fast. They are adding lots of new content and optimizing stuff pretty fast.
The game reminds me of a much more evolved original EQ, i beta'd eq and i think the vanguard beta is pretty much where eq was in the early stages.
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Desaitar
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 30 Apr 2003
Posts: 2641
Location: whore island
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Posted: 01/22/06 - 22:46 Post subject:
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| khrath wrote: | | FockTop wrote: | | trust me no 13-16 years old would stay in a game is they lose exp and maybe a level when they die. And it makes stupid people leave the game. |
That'd make everyone leave the game
Why would a char get weaker because they were defeated?
It's retanded
There's no reasoning to it |
Why can a char come back to life after it was killed?
EQ's death penalty was fine, WoW has no death penalty.
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FockTop
Sir Postalot
Joined: 23 Dec 2004
Posts: 1055
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Posted: 01/23/06 - 00:07 Post subject:
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| r00typooh wrote: | i can't wait for vanguard. i <3 brad in a completly straight way
brad makes games for the hardcore gamer not for the masses like every other MMO out there and even EQ since he and his team left. |
hardcore content, challenging not as much time shink as WoW
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merdocc
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 2038
Location: Pasadena Ca
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Posted: 01/23/06 - 03:30 Post subject:
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Got in to beta recently and played for about an hour then went back to WoW if that tells you anything. Coming from a person who played EQ since day 1. I will give it more time though to form an honest oppinion.
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Devook
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 31 Mar 2004
Posts: 2374
Location: Ypsilanti or Troy, MI
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Posted: 01/23/06 - 03:44 Post subject:
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| khrath wrote: | | FockTop wrote: | | trust me no 13-16 years old would stay in a game is they lose exp and maybe a level when they die. And it makes stupid people leave the game. |
That'd make everyone leave the game
Why would a char get weaker because they were defeated?
It's retanded
There's no reasoning to it |
You're being sarcastic right? I hope so, but I'm going to provide a counterpoint anyway.
You are beaten almost to death. Your arms and legs are severly mangled, you have a concussion, and it hurts for you to move. Would you say this is a step backwards or forwards?
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Gethy
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 5599
Location: Tallahassee, FL
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Posted: 01/23/06 - 04:17 Post subject:
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Warcraft is far too easy and far too forgiving. I wouldn't want to change it, however, since the overall scheme of the game would be unbearable (moreso than it already is at times) if they implemented further penalties upon death.
EverQuest had a good thing. Their death penalty was balanced for their game just as Warcraft's penalty is for it. But, obviously, EQ had the harsher of the two penalties.
I'd like to see how Vanguard does. Early EverQuest was a real f*****g cool thing, but the question is still up in the air: was the experience due to all of its firsts or was it because it was EverQuest, a solid gaming experience? Who knows and can convey that better than Brad?
I know nothing about Vanguard, but if, after its release (or during beta, whenever), I hear people get the impression of "early EQ", I'll probably do what I can to play it. And I think a lot of people will have likeminded thoughts.
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FockTop
Sir Postalot
Joined: 23 Dec 2004
Posts: 1055
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Posted: 01/23/06 - 04:40 Post subject:
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| Gethy wrote: | Warcraft is far too easy and far too forgiving. I wouldn't want to change it, however, since the overall scheme of the game would be unbearable (moreso than it already is at times) if they implemented further penalties upon death.
EverQuest had a good thing. Their death penalty was balanced for their game just as Warcraft's penalty is for it. But, obviously, EQ had the harsher of the two penalties.
I'd like to see how Vanguard does. Early EverQuest was a real f*****g cool thing, but the question is still up in the air: was the experience due to all of its firsts or was it because it was EverQuest, a solid gaming experience? Who knows and can convey that better than Brad?
I know nothing about Vanguard, but if, after its release (or during beta, whenever), I hear people get the impression of "early EQ", I'll probably do what I can to play it. And I think a lot of people will have likeminded thoughts. |
also would people have stayed in EQ qith the harsh death penalty before exp res if they had had many MMORPG choice? I don't think so.
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Kurel
RealPoor Sensei
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 1877
Location: Cali
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Posted: 01/23/06 - 06:39 Post subject:
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Prediction: The game will flop horribly.
Why: I stopped playing EQ for a reason.
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Devook
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 31 Mar 2004
Posts: 2374
Location: Ypsilanti or Troy, MI
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Posted: 01/23/06 - 07:32 Post subject:
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| Kurel wrote: | Prediction: The game will flop horribly.
Why: I stopped playing EQ for a reason. |
Does this seem like ridiculously faulty logic to anyone else?
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Ishmael
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 03 Jun 2005
Posts: 4446
Location: The US of A
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Posted: 01/23/06 - 08:29 Post subject:
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| Devook wrote: | | Kurel wrote: | Prediction: The game will flop horribly.
Why: I stopped playing EQ for a reason. |
Does this seem like ridiculously faulty logic to anyone else? |
Yes. Especially since EQ was at it's best when the guy producing this one was leading it. 
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Jakanden
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 11 Nov 2003
Posts: 5334
Location: Fuck if I know - I am always lost
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Posted: 01/23/06 - 08:58 Post subject:
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I think EQ was at it's best with Brad and if Vanguard is like EQ1 before Luclin then I am so there.
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Ishmael
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 03 Jun 2005
Posts: 4446
Location: The US of A
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Posted: 01/23/06 - 09:02 Post subject:
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Came across this while reading another forum this morning hehe...
| Quote: | I laugh at games like Vanguard calling themselves "next generation" mmorpgs. There hasn't been a "next generation" mmorpg ever, since they all revolve around leveling treadmills and the endless pursuit of new loot until you eBay out of boredom. The real hillarity in this game is just how blatant the leveling treadmill/timesinks are.
There's 3 Leveling treadmills in the game, and all of them are equal in lack of fun.
Combat
You'd think this is fun but it really isn't. They talked up a huge game about how Vanguard's combat involves more than just hitting Auto-Attack and hoping the monster runs out of Hitpoints before you do. You get to see a monsters attack ahead of time, and simply choose whatever button is flashing to deflect it. That's it, that's their huge "next generation" improvement to the boredom of playing a melee: waiting for icons to flash and then click on them hoping the server lag doesn't cause the spells to timeout.
Solo'ing is non-existant. You can solo for hours and you won't come near the exp you get if you wait around for a group. Solo'ing is immensely boring, since every tactic involves spamming your direct damage spell while tanking. Deaths are harsh, you lose exp, you're naked, and you have to run back to your corpse. Usually you'll die on the way since monsters hit you from far away with their extendo arms of death. There's also this hillarious bug right now where the guards assist the monster its fighting and will kill you.
Tradeskills
I've only tried tradeskilling once, and was amazed at the time involvement. According to the forums, it takes just as long as combat leveling to level while tradeskilling. Apparently its like EQ2, you sit there and some bars go up and down and you have to mash flashing buttons until you "finish" a product. Apparently some guy did this for days and days and is level five and makes "Grade D table legs".
Harvesting takes for f*****g ever. You have to group with other harvesters and you fight trees like you would a monster. Thats right, you need to get certain harvesting classes too, like "gleaners" and "refiners" in your group, and you sit around wacking some tree until the tree dies and then you get some loot. You then have to rest, since you get "tired" while wacking trees all day.
Want to solo while harvesting? Oh no you can't, because solo'ing doesn't exist at all in this game, if you solo it will A) take forever B) not get you anything meaningful C) you'll fail alot.
Parley..or the worst thing ever invented and is made fun of constantly on the beta forums
This is the best new "feature" of this great "next generation mmorpg". You have to parley with the npcs to get your quests. This is yet another ridiculous time sink. Thats right, when you want to talk to a npc about a quest, it opens a parley window where you fight the npc like a monster using arguments. You have the "dirty joke" spell, which lowers his liking of you, so then you have to reply with a "nice compliment" which then makes him like you more but then you have to keep the conversation interesting so you attack using a "interesting story"...I'm not making this shit up, you basically hammer keys until the conversation bar reaches the end(without other bars getting too low, its exactly like EQ2's crafting system) and you win the "parley".
Here's what is so great about it. EVERY SINGLE NPC makes you parley with him to get quest info. What is funny about it is that 95% of them have no quests or interesting info to give you, so you go from npc to npc parleying, mashing keys, until you "win" the "encounter" and you get nothing from it.
Overall
This game just f*****g blows. There's nothing positive I can say about it, it is that bad. I've beta'ed alot of video games and this one is fundamentally f****d. I don't think I could come up with a worse video game if I tried. I'm amazed the login screen doesn't have some sort of time sink or if I want to customize my UI I don't have to parley it with "witty jokes". LONG LIVE EVERQUEST BEFORE LUCLIN!! |
Here's a link to the thread if u care to read. http://www.eqnecro.net/board/viewtopic.php?t=2495&sid=9c1602775dff011d573a7584b1e1f084
P.S. Tradeskilling sounds rly gay lol.
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Aviger
RealPoor Sensei
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 1509
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Posted: 01/23/06 - 12:14 Post subject:
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If the game is like that review i shall never even touch it, that just sound f*****g boring and pointless (
Posted from a laptop in a s****y english airport that smells of p**s
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Thenger
Can't Stop Posting
Joined: 17 Oct 2002
Posts: 715
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Posted: 01/23/06 - 12:51 Post subject:
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Wow the game did seem pretty cool, but if it is like that review then all I see it as is a time sink, even bigger then any other multi-player game. Yeah the death penility in WoW may suck but thats great for the casual player.
Only time will tell to see if the game is any good, need to hear it from folks from here who play the game.
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Zimzulu
Toomuchtimeonhands
Joined: 02 Dec 2005
Posts: 883
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Posted: 01/23/06 - 12:57 Post subject:
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All MMO's are, are time sinks.
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Ishmael
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 03 Jun 2005
Posts: 4446
Location: The US of A
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Posted: 01/23/06 - 13:06 Post subject:
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I will prolly still try it out, no matter what review comes out, but yah from the sounds of that those systems all suck. I'm wondering how much of an rpg factor the game has in it, and how heavily immersive it will be mmo wise. WoW, and now eq just doesnt get the role playing aspect done for me anymore. It would be cool in EQ if there was an actual full roleplaying server, where people actualy roleplayed. (not FV, where maybe like 10 people actually roleplay) I kinda miss getting away, and living my character or whatver, as opposed to grinding exp, or killing some raid encounter, or ganking that level 30 noob ally rogue griefing people in the barrens. That might just be my super nerdy side talking though.
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Thenger
Can't Stop Posting
Joined: 17 Oct 2002
Posts: 715
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Posted: 01/23/06 - 13:14 Post subject:
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| Ishmael wrote: | | I will prolly still try it out, no matter what review comes out, but yah from the sounds of that those systems all suck. I'm wondering how much of an rpg factor the game has in it, and how heavily immersive it will be mmo wise. WoW, and now eq just doesnt get the role playing aspect done for me anymore. It would be cool in EQ if there was an actual full roleplaying server, where people actualy roleplayed. (not FV, where maybe like 10 people actually roleplay) I kinda miss getting away, and living my character or whatver, as opposed to grinding exp, or killing some raid encounter, or ganking that level 30 noob ally rogue griefing people in the barrens. That might just be my super nerdy side talking though. |
I know what you mean, when EQ first came out it was cool to role-play then as time went on if you were role-playing then you were a weirdo. The game changed from a roleplaying game just a hack and slash game.
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Ishmael
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 03 Jun 2005
Posts: 4446
Location: The US of A
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Posted: 01/23/06 - 13:17 Post subject:
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| Thenger wrote: | | Ishmael wrote: | | I will prolly still try it out, no matter what review comes out, but yah from the sounds of that those systems all suck. I'm wondering how much of an rpg factor the game has in it, and how heavily immersive it will be mmo wise. WoW, and now eq just doesnt get the role playing aspect done for me anymore. It would be cool in EQ if there was an actual full roleplaying server, where people actualy roleplayed. (not FV, where maybe like 10 people actually roleplay) I kinda miss getting away, and living my character or whatver, as opposed to grinding exp, or killing some raid encounter, or ganking that level 30 noob ally rogue griefing people in the barrens. That might just be my super nerdy side talking though. |
I know what you mean, when EQ first came out it was cool to role-play then as time went on if you were role-playing then you were a weirdo. The game changed from a roleplaying game just a hack and slash game. |
Yep.
WoW is the same way for me. I don't even read the quest b******t most the time, I just grab the quest, see what I gotta collect, and go do it. No immersion what so ever, just grinding, and doing one thing after another..yet I still play EQ, so maybe part of me likes it? =p
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Aumelen
Luke Warm
Joined: 19 Oct 2002
Posts: 100
Location: Woodland Hills, California
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Posted: 01/23/06 - 13:18 Post subject:
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| khrath wrote: | There is a reason WoW has decimated EQ, and EQ2's subscriber bases
Dieing isn't a big deal
PVP
If it goes like you suggest, I won't even play |
It's big due mainly due to its game. Warcraft is a popular title.
True, it may also be popular since dying isn't such a big deal. But that doesn't make it a good game. I'll rather have half the player base and a challenging game than an easy and dull game. Why do many kids play WoW? Not much penalties...kids hate penalties/punishments.
PvP in MMORPGs is a joke. RPG's is inheritely random (random number check against another random number); luck and gear the only factors to determine an outcome (unless you are completely brain dead and don't know how to press an auto-attack key and a skill/spell when it's enabled again).
And what the f**k do people expect out of an RPG? RPGs have always been about mindless number checks. "Waaa! Combat is boring. I see a monster and press some buttons! Unfun~" When you enter combat it does some rolls and determines who wins. There has never been anything special about it. Sure, developers can toss in new things here and there, but the core mechanics of the genre will remain the same--if it doesn't then it's not a RPG.
And the thing about soloing: it sucks in any game. If someone makes a game where soloing is as productive as grouping it will rot. Why the hell would anyone want to group? People would get bored of it ten times faster. Gear and accomplishments will be nothing. If you want to solo, play a traditional RPG. This is what really made EQ shine in the past. It took commitment (e.g. time). It took teamwork. It made the few people say, "omg, we finally did it."
Lastly, a game is only as fun as the people you play it with. If you know a good amount of people in a title you have fun with, chances are you will have fun playing that game no matter how crappy the mechanics are.
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