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Pankrat
Can't Stop Posting

Joined: 12 Oct 2002 Posts: 603
Location: Land of Paranoia
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Posted: 06/22/04 - 19:16 Post subject: Unfairenheit 9/11 - Michael Moore pwned
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http://slate.msn.com/id/2102723/
Great article, some excerpts:
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To describe this film as dishonest and demagogic would almost be to promote those terms to the level of respectability. To describe this film as a piece of crap would be to run the risk of a discourse that would never again rise above the excremental. To describe it as an exercise in facile crowd-pleasing would be too obvious. Fahrenheit 9/11 is a sinister exercise in moral frivolity, crudely disguised as an exercise in seriousness. It is also a spectacle of abject political cowardice masking itself as a demonstration of "dissenting" bravery.
In late 2002, almost a year after the al-Qaida assault on American society, I had an onstage debate with Michael Moore at the Telluride Film Festival. In the course of this exchange, he stated his view that Osama Bin Laden should be considered innocent until proven guilty. This was, he said, the American way. The intervention in Afghanistan, he maintained, had been at least to that extent unjustified. Something—I cannot guess what, since we knew as much then as we do now—has since apparently persuaded Moore that Osama Bin Laden is as guilty as hell. Indeed, Osama is suddenly so guilty and so all-powerful that any other discussion of any other topic is a dangerous "distraction" from the fight against him. I believe that I understand the convenience of this late conversion.
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Perhaps vaguely aware that his movie so completely lacks gravitas, Moore concludes with a sonorous reading of some words from George Orwell. The words are taken from 1984 and consist of a third-person analysis of a hypothetical, endless, and contrived war between three superpowers. The clear intention, as clumsily excerpted like this (...) is to suggest that there is no moral distinction between the United States, the Taliban, and the Baath Party and that the war against jihad is about nothing. If Moore had studied a bit more, or at all, he could have read Orwell really saying, and in his own voice, the following:
The majority of pacifists either belong to obscure religious sects or are simply humanitarians who object to taking life and prefer not to follow their thoughts beyond that point. But there is a minority of intellectual pacifists, whose real though unacknowledged motive appears to be hatred of western democracy and admiration for totalitarianism. Pacifist propaganda usually boils down to saying that one side is as bad as the other, but if one looks closely at the writing of the younger intellectual pacifists, one finds that they do not by any means express impartial disapproval but are directed almost entirely against Britain and the United States …
And that's just from Orwell's Notes on Nationalism in May 1945. A short word of advice: In general, it's highly unwise to quote Orwell if you are already way out of your depth on the question of moral equivalence. It's also incautious to remind people of Orwell if you are engaged in a sophomoric celluloid rewriting of recent history.
If Michael Moore had had his way, Slobodan Milosevic would still be the big man in a starved and tyrannical Serbia. Bosnia and Kosovo would have been cleansed and annexed. If Michael Moore had been listened to, Afghanistan would still be under Taliban rule, and Kuwait would have remained part of Iraq. And Iraq itself would still be the personal property of a psychopathic crime family, bargaining covertly with the slave state of North Korea for WMD. You might hope that a retrospective awareness of this kind would induce a little modesty. To the contrary, it is employed to pump air into one of the great sagging blimps of our sorry, mediocre, celeb-rotten culture. Rock the vote, indeed.
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median
RealPoor Guru

Joined: 16 Oct 2002 Posts: 2183
Location: Hamillton, Canada
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Posted: 06/22/04 - 19:18 Post subject:
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It won an award at the New Zealand film festival!
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Paco
RealPoor Jedi

Joined: 13 Oct 2002 Posts: 12939
Location: Jacksonville, FL
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Posted: 06/22/04 - 19:45 Post subject:
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| median wrote: | | It won an award at the New Zealand film festival! |
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Docter
RealPoor Guru

Joined: 21 Oct 2002 Posts: 3420
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Posted: 06/22/04 - 19:57 Post subject:
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| median wrote: | | It won an award at the New Zealand film festival! |
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Barnacle Bob
RealPoor Guru

Joined: 11 Oct 2002 Posts: 2135
Location: WHO KNOWS WHERE I'LL TURN UP!
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Posted: 06/22/04 - 20:10 Post subject:
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Cool pictures!
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Akronn
RealPoor Master of Posts

Joined: 11 Oct 2002 Posts: 8752
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Posted: 06/22/04 - 20:11 Post subject:
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Damage control has begun, and the movie isn't even out yet!
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Goraz
RealPoor Guru

Joined: 11 Oct 2002 Posts: 3736
Location: Philadelphia
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Posted: 06/22/04 - 20:17 Post subject:
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f**k michael moore.
c**t rag.
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Jakanden
RealPoor Master of Posts

Joined: 11 Nov 2003 Posts: 5334
Location: Fuck if I know - I am always lost
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Posted: 06/22/04 - 20:31 Post subject:
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I want to see Michael Moore Hates America. I cant stand that fat f****r. Im glad his appeal to the MPAA got turned down.
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Confused
RealPoor Master of Posts

Joined: 08 Feb 2004 Posts: 6730
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Posted: 06/22/04 - 20:46 Post subject:
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| Akronn wrote: | | Damage control has begun, and the movie isn't even out yet! |
c**t
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Haphasto
RealPoor Sensei

Joined: 10 Nov 2002 Posts: 1800
Location: St. Louis, MO
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Posted: 06/22/04 - 21:18 Post subject:
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didn't read the whole thing, and trying to do too many things at once, so didn't read too much into it after I saw this. So correct me if he clarified this. but ....
| Quote: | | he stated his view that Osama Bin Laden should be considered innocent until proven guilty. This was, he said, the American way |
what a piece of shit
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wellspoken
RealPoor Master of Posts

Joined: 01 Feb 2003 Posts: 7137
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Posted: 06/22/04 - 21:45 Post subject:
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| Haphasto_S wrote: | | what a piece of shit |
Even looks like a piece of shit too.
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Haphasto
RealPoor Sensei

Joined: 10 Nov 2002 Posts: 1800
Location: St. Louis, MO
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Posted: 06/22/04 - 21:55 Post subject:
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whee

Last edited by Haphasto on 06/22/04 - 22:01; edited 2 times in total
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Ikkan
RealPoor Guru

Joined: 06 Sep 2003 Posts: 3086
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Posted: 06/22/04 - 21:56 Post subject:
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| Kbarr's #1 fan wrote: | | Haphasto_S wrote: | | what a piece of shit |
Even looks like a piece of shit too.
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f*g like whoa Michael Moore is!
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Rycrias
Luke Warm

Joined: 21 Oct 2002 Posts: 269
Location: Indianapolis, IN
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Posted: 06/22/04 - 22:19 Post subject:
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I would LOVE to debate that fat b*****d in a public forum. However, as he begins blabbering incoherently, I would casually walk over to his podium and snap his f*****g neck, all the while having a huge shit-eating grin on my face.
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Frax
RealPoor Master of Posts

Joined: 11 Oct 2002 Posts: 8489
Location: Fuck yoiu fucking fuckers
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Posted: 06/22/04 - 22:33 Post subject:
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Michael Moore is a national embarassment. He hasn't made a factual documentary, well, ever. He is an activist, not an objective filmmaker.
He's even threatening to sue the guys making a documentary about him (or anyone) if he thinks they slander him or portray him in a bad light. What a f*****g hypocrite.
Thank god looney toons like this guy are on the outside of mainstream America.
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Banzai
Guest
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Posted: 06/22/04 - 23:48 Post subject:
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Should be an interesting screening. Opens this week right?
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Jakanden
RealPoor Master of Posts

Joined: 11 Nov 2003 Posts: 5334
Location: Fuck if I know - I am always lost
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Posted: 06/23/04 - 00:04 Post subject:
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| Banzai wrote: | | Should be an interesting screening. |
Nope
| Banzai wrote: | | Opens this week right? |
Yep
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Tolanin
RealPoor Guru

Joined: 16 Oct 2002 Posts: 3551
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Posted: 06/23/04 - 00:08 Post subject:
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| Jakanden wrote: | | Banzai wrote: | | Should be an interesting screening. |
Nope
| Banzai wrote: | | Opens this week right? |
Yep |
you dont find comedys interesting?
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Manuva
Banned

Joined: 12 Oct 2002 Posts: 2536
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Posted: 06/23/04 - 00:22 Post subject:
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I did like Bowling for Columbine
but he's a f*****g piece of shit
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wellspoken
RealPoor Master of Posts

Joined: 01 Feb 2003 Posts: 7137
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Posted: 06/23/04 - 00:31 Post subject:
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| Rycrias wrote: | I would LOVE to debate that fat b*****d in a public forum. However, as he begins blabbering incoherently, I would casually walk over to his podium and snap his f*****g neck, all the while having a huge shit-eating grin on my face.  |
With your keyboard?
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Goraz
RealPoor Guru

Joined: 11 Oct 2002 Posts: 3736
Location: Philadelphia
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Posted: 06/23/04 - 01:07 Post subject:
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| Kbarr's #1 fan wrote: | | Haphasto_S wrote: | | what a piece of shit |
Even looks like a piece of shit too.
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rofl.
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Rycrias
Luke Warm

Joined: 21 Oct 2002 Posts: 269
Location: Indianapolis, IN
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Posted: 06/23/04 - 01:12 Post subject:
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No. Not an internet forum. A face-to face public forum. Although, having powers mighty enough to accomplish said task via keyboard and monitor would be easier, it wouldnt be quite as satisfying as using my bare hands.
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wellspoken
RealPoor Master of Posts

Joined: 01 Feb 2003 Posts: 7137
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Posted: 06/23/04 - 01:16 Post subject:
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| Rycrias wrote: | | No. Not an internet forum. A face-to face public forum. Although, having powers mighty enough to accomplish said task via keyboard and monitor would be easier, it wouldnt be quite as satisfying as using my bare hands. |
mmm hmm
internet tough guy huh. lol
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atarom
Dalai Lama of RealPoor

Joined: 11 Oct 2002 Posts: 16395
Location: 375th st. Y
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Posted: 06/23/04 - 02:17 Post subject:
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blah ablah blah afgragb blagbabahla;blag GaRaggabalrjabla
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ATM Banana
RealPoor Master of Posts

Joined: 02 Jan 2003 Posts: 8575
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Posted: 06/23/04 - 02:54 Post subject:
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atarom is right, this will result in campaigning movies every election year.
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Silvermouse
RealPoor Jedi

Joined: 12 Oct 2002 Posts: 11015
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Posted: 06/23/04 - 03:16 Post subject:
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| atarom wrote: | | blah ablah blah afgragb blagbabahla;blag GaRaggabalrjabla |
Exactly. Who f*****g cares. It's a movie. If you don't like the guy, send him some hate mail instead of telling all of us how much he sucks or should be beaten. Everytime his name comes up here it's the same thing!
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Guest
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Posted: 06/23/04 - 04:27 Post subject:
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| Silvermouse wrote: | | atarom wrote: | | blah ablah blah afgragb blagbabahla;blag GaRaggabalrjabla |
Exactly. Who f*****g cares. It's a movie. If you don't like the guy, send him some hate mail instead of telling all of us how much he sucks or should be beaten. Everytime his name comes up here it's the same thing! |
No.
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kemble
RealPoor Sensei

Joined: 14 Oct 2002 Posts: 1909
Location: MI
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Posted: 06/23/04 - 08:56 Post subject:
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| Rycrias wrote: | I would LOVE to debate that fat b*****d in a public forum. However, as he begins blabbering incoherently, I would casually walk over to his podium and snap his f*****g neck, all the while having a huge shit-eating grin on my face.  |
Who slaps people in the NECK?
OWW!!! My Neck!
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Celestra
RealPoor Master of Posts

Joined: 11 Oct 2002 Posts: 6929
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Posted: 06/23/04 - 09:00 Post subject:
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kemble
RealPoor Sensei

Joined: 14 Oct 2002 Posts: 1909
Location: MI
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Posted: 06/23/04 - 10:13 Post subject:
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