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Brael
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 2122
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 Posted: 07/28/05 - 21:37 Post subject: Space Shuttle program
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Since Confuseds oh so "brilliant" post it got me wondering... those of you who support the program still, why? Same question for those that oppose it.
I personally support the program still but only because we're going to eliminate it soon. Sending humans into space is one of the most beneficial things we can do so halting it is out of the question but at the same time, we have 4 shuttles, 3 in active service, and it's a drain to keep them running. As it is our space program is too small, it's just too bad its development is being hindered by the time it takes to create a shuttle replacement.
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Confused
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 08 Feb 2004
Posts: 6730
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Posted: 07/28/05 - 21:42 Post subject: Re: Space Shuttle program
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| Brael wrote: | | Confuseds oh so "brilliant" post |
Why...Thank you!
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Desflurane
Luke Warm
Joined: 27 Mar 2003
Posts: 299
Location: St Louis
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Posted: 07/28/05 - 22:03 Post subject:
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When I was in elementary school, EVERY launch used to be covered on national TV. Later we stopped thinking it was much of a big deal sending men into space... now a piece of foam falls off one of the boosters and we're talking about scrapping the whole damn thing.
If we had kept our intensity we wouldn't be half assing a space station.. but instead would probably have a colony on the moon.
It's really too bad we've lost our drive... we need more inventions like TANG!
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kireol
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 02 Aug 2003
Posts: 9517
Location: Royal Oak, MI
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Posted: 07/28/05 - 22:50 Post subject:
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most of Confused's posts are.....well....let's just say he chose the PERFECT name
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xizorr
Luke Warm
Joined: 20 Apr 2004
Posts: 236
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Posted: 07/29/05 - 10:32 Post subject:
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| Desflurane wrote: | When I was in elementary school, EVERY launch used to be covered on national TV. Later we stopped thinking it was much of a big deal sending men into space... now a piece of foam falls off one of the boosters and we're talking about scrapping the whole damn thing.
If we had kept our intensity we wouldn't be half assing a space station.. but instead would probably have a colony on the moon.
It's really too bad we've lost our drive... we need more inventions like TANG! |
we need a cold war with China and for them to have a space program like ours that would do it. We would start pooring money into it.
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Confused
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 08 Feb 2004
Posts: 6730
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Posted: 07/29/05 - 10:48 Post subject:
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| xizorr wrote: | | Desflurane wrote: | When I was in elementary school, EVERY launch used to be covered on national TV. Later we stopped thinking it was much of a big deal sending men into space... now a piece of foam falls off one of the boosters and we're talking about scrapping the whole damn thing.
If we had kept our intensity we wouldn't be half assing a space station.. but instead would probably have a colony on the moon.
It's really too bad we've lost our drive... we need more inventions like TANG! |
we need a cold war with China and for them to have a space program like ours that would do it. We would start pooring money into it. |
We need more than money. We need a clear vision. Nobody knows what we're doing or wear we're going, so we keep spending billions of dollars on missions testing mouse hats. It's kind of dumb.
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Isriam
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 15 Oct 2002
Posts: 2721
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Posted: 07/29/05 - 11:31 Post subject:
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so are road trips. but people enjoy traveling don't they.
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Brael
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 2122
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Posted: 07/29/05 - 13:27 Post subject:
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Umm, we have a vision... returning to the moon (btw it's sad we could goto the moon 35 years ago and can't now) then going to Mars. The whole ISS thing is useful too for experiments.
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Confused
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 08 Feb 2004
Posts: 6730
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Posted: 07/29/05 - 13:29 Post subject:
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| Brael wrote: | | Umm, we have a vision... returning to the moon (btw it's sad we could goto the moon 35 years ago and can't now) then going to Mars. The whole ISS thing is useful too for experiments. |
Really? What progress has NASA made towards this goal that I've never heard of?
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goatface
Sir Postalot
Joined: 12 Oct 2002
Posts: 1354
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Posted: 07/29/05 - 13:35 Post subject:
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is there a reason to go to the moon?
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motherface
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 12 Mar 2003
Posts: 3407
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Posted: 07/29/05 - 13:37 Post subject:
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| goatface wrote: | | is there a reason to go to the moon? |
For cheese?
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Ishmael
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 03 Jun 2005
Posts: 4446
Location: The US of A
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Posted: 07/29/05 - 13:42 Post subject:
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| goatface wrote: | | is there a reason to go to the moon? |
Military Bases.
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Overon
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 14 Oct 2002
Posts: 3602
Location: PLANE OF PIXIES
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Posted: 07/29/05 - 13:53 Post subject:
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| Ishmael wrote: | | goatface wrote: | | is there a reason to go to the moon? |
Military Bases. |
maybe going to the moon itself seems trivial to you .. but the act in itself leaves a lot of room for inventions to be created suited to the task .. those inventions then have many alternate possibilities ..
.. as far as I know, internet started out in the military and was not originally intended for anything like what internet is today ... if it wasn't for that "useless" pouring of money into military research I wouldn't be wasting my time talking to you right now
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Kurel
RealPoor Sensei
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 1877
Location: Cali
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Posted: 07/29/05 - 13:55 Post subject:
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| motherface wrote: | | goatface wrote: | | is there a reason to go to the moon? |
For cheese? |
The Launch System used to goto the Moon will probably either be used for the Mars mission, or lead up to it. It's a stepping stone to start rebuilding the technology that we need.
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kbarr
RealPoor Jedi
Joined: 05 Oct 2004
Posts: 11239
Location: New York, now go fuck off...
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Posted: 07/29/05 - 14:00 Post subject:
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| Ishmael wrote: | | goatface wrote: | | is there a reason to go to the moon? |
Military Bases. |
#1 reason, military bases.
#2 reason, set up point for manned missions to mars.
Reason we are going to Mars?
#1 reason, military bases.
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Overon
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 14 Oct 2002
Posts: 3602
Location: PLANE OF PIXIES
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Posted: 07/29/05 - 14:04 Post subject:
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#2 reason is to make the movie Total Recall into reality
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motherface
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 12 Mar 2003
Posts: 3407
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Posted: 07/29/05 - 14:24 Post subject:
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It would be quite awesome if we colonized the entire moon before the Chinese figured out what was going on.
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Overon
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 14 Oct 2002
Posts: 3602
Location: PLANE OF PIXIES
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Posted: 07/29/05 - 14:37 Post subject:
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| motherface wrote: | | It would be quite awesome if we colonized the entire moon before the Chinese figured out what was going on. |
and put a big american flag on the surface of the moon visible from earth
either that or a big "FU CHINA"
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IceIsFun
Toomuchtimeonhands
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 781
Location: Orlando, FL
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Posted: 07/29/05 - 14:51 Post subject:
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| Kbarr wrote: | | Ishmael wrote: | | goatface wrote: | | is there a reason to go to the moon? |
Military Bases. |
#1 reason, military bases.
#2 reason, set up point for manned missions to mars.
Reason we are going to Mars?
#1 reason, military bases. |
#2 reason for going to mars: hockey!
http://www.esa.int/SPECIALS/Mars_Express/SEMGKA808BE_0.html
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xizorr
Luke Warm
Joined: 20 Apr 2004
Posts: 236
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Posted: 07/29/05 - 15:00 Post subject:
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| Confused wrote: | | xizorr wrote: | | Desflurane wrote: | When I was in elementary school, EVERY launch used to be covered on national TV. Later we stopped thinking it was much of a big deal sending men into space... now a piece of foam falls off one of the boosters and we're talking about scrapping the whole damn thing.
If we had kept our intensity we wouldn't be half assing a space station.. but instead would probably have a colony on the moon.
It's really too bad we've lost our drive... we need more inventions like TANG! |
we need a cold war with China and for them to have a space program like ours that would do it. We would start pooring money into it. |
We need more than money. We need a clear vision. Nobody knows what we're doing or wear we're going, so we keep spending billions of dollars on missions testing mouse hats. It's kind of dumb. |
umm where have you been under a rock?
The vision is to go to the moon then mars, this has been the plan for several years. Their Budget has been reduced more and more each year. Preventing them from moving faster, why do you think the Hubble is going bye bye. Because that money was better spent on other projects they felt were more important.. In case you don't remeber the first space race with Russia alot of it was having money thrown at R&D to try and win the race.
The moon servers 2 purposes one to prove we can do it again, 2 for testing systems that will be used to get to mars. There is much debate if the space station will be staging area for these missions.
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Overon
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 14 Oct 2002
Posts: 3602
Location: PLANE OF PIXIES
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Posted: 07/29/05 - 15:01 Post subject:
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| Quote: | | The average recorded temperature on Mars is -63 °C (-81 °F) with a maximum temperature of 20 °C (68 °F) and a minimum of -140 °C (-220 °F). |
go iceblocks!
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Confused
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 08 Feb 2004
Posts: 6730
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Posted: 07/29/05 - 15:02 Post subject:
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| xizorr wrote: | | Confused wrote: | | xizorr wrote: | | Desflurane wrote: | When I was in elementary school, EVERY launch used to be covered on national TV. Later we stopped thinking it was much of a big deal sending men into space... now a piece of foam falls off one of the boosters and we're talking about scrapping the whole damn thing.
If we had kept our intensity we wouldn't be half assing a space station.. but instead would probably have a colony on the moon.
It's really too bad we've lost our drive... we need more inventions like TANG! |
we need a cold war with China and for them to have a space program like ours that would do it. We would start pooring money into it. |
We need more than money. We need a clear vision. Nobody knows what we're doing or wear we're going, so we keep spending billions of dollars on missions testing mouse hats. It's kind of dumb. |
umm where have you been under a rock?
The vision is to go to the moon then mars, this has been the plan for several years. Their Budget has been reduced more and more each year. Preventing them from moving faster, why do you think the Hubble is going bye bye. Because that money was better spent on other projects they felt were more important.. In case you don't remeber the first space race with Russia alot of it was having money thrown at R&D to try and win the race.
The moon servers 2 purposes one to prove we can do it again, 2 for testing systems that will be used to get to mars. There is much debate if the space station will be staging area for these missions. |
Just because Bush came out and tried to score points by saying we need to put a man on Mars does not make it a vision. I have heard of no plans whatsoever to design any new spacecraft for such a project...long term or short term. We don't get anything out of the space shuttle anymore. Why isn't that money diverted to something more productive?
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xizorr
Luke Warm
Joined: 20 Apr 2004
Posts: 236
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Posted: 07/29/05 - 16:06 Post subject:
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| Quote: | | Just because Bush came out and tried to score points by saying we need to put a man on Mars does not make it a vision. |
LOL The idea of mars and putting a man on it started before bush. Bush just tried to score points on reinforcing the idea. The reason they will go to the moon first is to test things.It is better to happen closer to earth than further out on non tested systems.
| Quote: | | Why isn't that money diverted to something more productive? |
like what?
The sun will not last forever. We will have to find another planet to live on. Can't wait until the last minute for this one. You have to start somewhere and going planets in our own solar system is a good place to start.
| Quote: | | I have heard of no plans whatsoever to design any new spacecraft for such a project...long term or short term. |
Sorry you don't know any of this. The current Shuttle hits retirement in 2010. Possible earlier if any more problem happen. The next generation Shuttles are do out somewhere around 2012. First launch date is set for 2016, so they were talking about extending the life of current shuttle to make up for this. This was even mentioned as of late on CNN when they were asked about new crew safety in the current shuttle. They said these couldn't be modified but the new one were being designed with that in mind.
| Quote: | | We don't get anything out of the space shuttle anymore |
The repair Sats, bring cargo and equipment to the space station. Also testing ideas that could be used for future projects. Testing of new medicines and much more. Not sure how we get nothing out of them.
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Overon
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 14 Oct 2002
Posts: 3602
Location: PLANE OF PIXIES
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Posted: 07/29/05 - 16:14 Post subject:
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| Quote: | | The sun will not last forever. We will have to find another planet to live on. Can't wait until the last minute for this one. You have to start somewhere and going planets in our own solar system is a good place to start. |
the absurdity of this statement is intense .. let me break it down a bit
| Quote: | | The sun will not last forever. We will have to find another planet to live on. |
i sincerely doubt the sun's eventual death in a few billion years is what causes humanity's destruction
| Quote: | | Can't wait until the last minute for this one. |
how long is recorded human history? a few thousand years? i think we have a few billion years to get the ball rolling on colonizing any potentially inhabitable planets... maybe we should look to more immediate concerns .. like the impending energy crisis ... which we are ignoring ..
.. but maybe you're right .. we really need to worry about something that is going to happen in 5 billion years, and not something that has the potential to seriously affect our lifestyle within (at the most) the next century (not even saying what it has already done)
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Confused
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 08 Feb 2004
Posts: 6730
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Posted: 07/29/05 - 16:21 Post subject:
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| xizorr wrote: | | Quote: | | Just because Bush came out and tried to score points by saying we need to put a man on Mars does not make it a vision. |
LOL The idea of mars and putting a man on it started before bush. Bush just tried to score points on reinforcing the idea. The reason they will go to the moon first is to test things.It is better to happen closer to earth than further out on non tested systems.
| Quote: | | Why isn't that money diverted to something more productive? |
like what?
The sun will not last forever. We will have to find another planet to live on. Can't wait until the last minute for this one. You have to start somewhere and going planets in our own solar system is a good place to start.
| Quote: | | I have heard of no plans whatsoever to design any new spacecraft for such a project...long term or short term. |
Sorry you don't know any of this. The current Shuttle hits retirement in 2010. Possible earlier if any more problem happen. The next generation Shuttles are do out somewhere around 2012. First launch date is set for 2016, so they were talking about extending the life of current shuttle to make up for this. This was even mentioned as of late on CNN when they were asked about new crew safety in the current shuttle. They said these couldn't be modified but the new one were being designed with that in mind.
| Quote: | | We don't get anything out of the space shuttle anymore |
The repair Sats, bring cargo and equipment to the space station. Also testing ideas that could be used for future projects. Testing of new medicines and much more. Not sure how we get nothing out of them. |
You actually think there's going to be a new shuttle in 7 years?? Are you really that stupid? NASA has about a 50% success rate with their missions nowadays. They've lost their edge. The "new shuttle" has been in the earliest design phase for years without any progress whatsoever. NASA has one goal...To justify it's budget and get more money. It is a shadow of what it once was and without serious reform, is just a waste of money.
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Brael
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 2122
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Posted: 07/29/05 - 16:27 Post subject:
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The X33 was canceled, we were supposed to be using a shuttles replacement already if not for that I believe. Hopefully the X34 comes out on time.
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Ishmael
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 03 Jun 2005
Posts: 4446
Location: The US of A
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Posted: 07/29/05 - 16:28 Post subject:
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| Overon wrote: | | Quote: | | The sun will not last forever. We will have to find another planet to live on. Can't wait until the last minute for this one. You have to start somewhere and going planets in our own solar system is a good place to start. |
the absurdity of this statement is intense .. let me break it down a bit
| Quote: | | The sun will not last forever. We will have to find another planet to live on. |
i sincerely doubt the sun's eventual death in a few billion years is what causes humanity's destruction
| Quote: | | Can't wait until the last minute for this one. |
how long is recorded human history? a few thousand years? i think we have a few billion years to get the ball rolling on colonizing any potentially inhabitable planets... maybe we should look to more immediate concerns .. like the impending energy crisis ... which we are ignoring ..
.. but maybe you're right .. we really need to worry about something that is going to happen in 5 billion years, and not something that has the potential to seriously affect our lifestyle within (at the most) the next century (not even saying what it has already done) |
Where else are Americans going to live after WW3? This planet will be f****d
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Confused
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 08 Feb 2004
Posts: 6730
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Brael
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 2122
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Posted: 07/29/05 - 17:03 Post subject:
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Lame.
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xizorr
Luke Warm
Joined: 20 Apr 2004
Posts: 236
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Posted: 07/29/05 - 17:17 Post subject:
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single-stage-to-orbit spaceliner, has been scrapped. In addition, the American space agency announced that another reusable rocket, the X-34, is being axed.
Those 2 are new launch method space craft. There is a newer shuttle that is in the works of design now, it is no were near the stages of the X-33 it doesn't even have a designation yet.
Check out the news that been on lately with press confrences that have even talked about the ideas going into the shuttle design.
There will be plenty more unmaned missions to mars before there is a flight there. I think the goal they had was like 2050 of this happening. So no there is no craft in current works for mars as of yet.
5 billion years is a long time to bad the heat from the sun will make the earth a little to hot to support life in its current state. You need to look at the study of growth and magnetics of the sun over the last 20 years to understand that the radiation and magnetics of the sun will kill us way before the sun burns out. Last time I looked there was not enough data to give an estimate due to the time fram of data, but this also part of global warming as well. And is one of the factors.
Also and as you stated we will probably kill our planet before then if things don't change so 5 billion years is down to what 5,000-10,000 years. Don't forget about comets and such as well. No telling when we will have to do something about one of those.
Space is a big place and finding a planet we can live on will take a long time.
Energy, I agree more money does need to go to new solutions, but at the same time can't stop everything else for it. Big oil has hurt this more than anything else. One of the missions to mars is looking for fuels and raw materials that we can use here. But how we would get them is another story and many many years away.
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