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khrath
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 8750
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 Posted: 02/04/05 - 09:05 Post subject: Rogue Question
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Whats the differences at end game between a dagger build and a sword build.
I'm looking at either going stealth/sword with high sustained melle dmg, or dagger with high crits, just cant decide
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FockTop
Sir Postalot
Joined: 23 Dec 2004
Posts: 1055
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Posted: 02/04/05 - 09:27 Post subject: Re: Rogue Question
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| khrath wrote: | Whats the differences at end game between a dagger build and a sword build.
I'm looking at either going stealth/sword with high sustained melle dmg, or dagger with high crits, just cant decide |
penis size wise I would go for the sword.
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halfbent
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 2944
Location: Kentwood, Mi
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Posted: 02/04/05 - 09:40 Post subject:
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If you're going to have some sort of duo/group buddy who can hold aggro, go with an ambush/dagger build. Otherwise, I'd stick to a mace or a sword with high max dmg for nice SS crits. I started off with an ambush build, and ended up respeccing for Seal Fate/Cold Blood (to take advantage of it's brokenness,) and will probably stick with it even if they fix it. I loved seeing the big numbers with ambush, but I solo'd most of the time, so it was a whole talent build centered around the first hit of the fight.
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selluplatz
Rookie
Joined: 08 Apr 2003
Posts: 88
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Posted: 02/04/05 - 13:52 Post subject:
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I went sword build for 60 levels, and while its okay it isn't something that requires much more than some timing, a little luck, and pushing a few buttons..don't get me wrong, a sword build is great, dual weilding rend's swords is very good, but the amount of skill needed to play a sword build to its fullest compared to a dagger build is a joke really. I had a heartseeker made yesterday, and i've been messing with that a lot. I really like the dagger build and if it is played well i think it could be an extreme amount better than a sword build.
One of my big disappointments with sword build was a well played cold mage could rock my world 90% of the time. I was spec'd combat/ass build with swords, but quickly switched to coldblood/prep build (yes in swords) and last night i respec'd to a dagger spec coldblood/prep (with ambush and just enough in combat for imp bs.) ill let you know how it works out, but from what i pvp'd with last night it was outstanding (outstanding being dropping level 60 warriors losing maybe 500 to 700 hp max) i will post my build if ya want to see it, or my old sword build if thats how you want to go... either way id suggest going coldblood/prep
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motherface
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 12 Mar 2003
Posts: 3407
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Posted: 02/04/05 - 14:11 Post subject:
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| selluplatz wrote: | | it isn't something that requires much more than some timing, a little luck, and pushing a few buttons. |
Well you just described 90% of all games?
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selluplatz
Rookie
Joined: 08 Apr 2003
Posts: 88
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Posted: 02/04/05 - 14:46 Post subject:
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in essence yeah, but you konw what i mean, with a sword build you dont do a whole lot other than sinister strike, with a dagger build its a bit more complicated.
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evilution
Can't Stop Posting
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 618
Location: 69 Ville
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Posted: 02/04/05 - 15:28 Post subject:
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sword
sinister strike 4tw
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GruntingCod
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 6399
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Posted: 02/04/05 - 15:34 Post subject:
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Apparently Sword Spec is broken, but thats besides the point, it gives you 5 extra points that any other build would normally require.
I, myself, am going to go a dagger build once I get a Shanker and Heartseeker/Deathstriker. Untill t hen, I will probably stay maces if not swords, once I am able to get Dal'Rends set.
I choose maces becasue I like the stun. Although the stun cannot be depended on to interupt mobs casting and what not, it helps ALOT with down time and what I can take, cannot take, how many mobs I can kill before I die, etc.
I would choose swords soley on the fact that Dal'Rends is one of the best weapon combo's in the game. That, and the added 5 points will help out on getting other talents I would like, such as Camo or another combat/ass talent.
I would base it off of the gear you get when you get high level. Don't worry about respeccing, the cap of respec costs is what? 20g? Thats an hour of farming at 60, if that, try different builds out. Stick with sword/mace while leveling becasue they *are* the best for grinding. Keep a dagger around with you once you get ambush for grinding purposes. Find yourself a good weapon swap macro as well.
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Kayas
Luke Warm
Joined: 12 Nov 2002
Posts: 183
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Posted: 02/04/05 - 18:23 Post subject:
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I'm currently 30 in assassination and 18 in combat. No spec but I have the +backstab crits.
Seal Fate and Cold blood are ruthless. I also have improved cheap shot which owns with backstabs. You still hit normally but get some high damage backstabs in also. Gouge is overrated unless in PK and you want to use it to heal but I have blind for that. In one more level I'm sure I'll get a Heartseeker as my brother and I have nearly 30 arcanite bars and a stack or two of diamonds, emeralds and opals. I may respec for more ambush stuff but one hit is not worth all those talent points. 3 points for 30% additional backstab crit chance is great. With Seal Fate I go through 10 combo points in about 8 seconds usually.
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GruntingCod
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 6399
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Posted: 02/04/05 - 18:51 Post subject:
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Gouge is overrated? LOL
Imp gouge = nearly full use of a bandaid. At 53, runecloth doesn't come very easily, and getting full useage out of it is key. Being able to grind and never stop (Using gouge to regen energy and use a banaid) is essential for me personally. Only costing 3 points in the combat tree, which is my main tree, is a drop in the bucket, especially while choosing imp SS as well, that equals to 5, which is required for the 2nd tier.
Although I do agree that Cold Blood and Seal Fate rock, but seal fate is pretty damned worthless for pve imo.
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Occulis
RealPoor Jedi
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 13293
Location: Moral Relativity Central
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Posted: 02/04/05 - 18:56 Post subject:
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| GruntingCod wrote: |
I, myself,
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roffle
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Malodious
Toomuchtimeonhands
Joined: 02 May 2003
Posts: 991
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Posted: 02/04/05 - 23:04 Post subject:
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I went 30 levels from about 20-50 with duel maces (just because, dont be a hater on maces I think they look neat). Mainly going into the combat tree, it was real nice at the time but at 56 I am now specced 29/8/10 atm i'll finish off seal fate next level but i'm really loving it. Imo seal fate is pretty hot for PvE, can practicaly spam 5 pt eviscerates and in pvp it's damn near godly.
Even if they fix seal fate i'd still use it.
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GruntingCod
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 6399
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Posted: 02/05/05 - 02:23 Post subject:
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| Occulis wrote: | | GruntingCod wrote: |
I, myself,
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roffle |
I have to clarify to the people who don't understand the word "Myself" or "I".
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Jinu
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 2396
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Posted: 02/05/05 - 03:03 Post subject:
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No mention of a mace build?
I am holding 2 maces, and with 3 points in mace spec, I get stun at least once every other fight.
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GruntingCod
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 6399
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Posted: 02/05/05 - 05:50 Post subject:
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| Jinu wrote: | No mention of a mace build?
I am holding 2 maces, and with 3 points in mace spec, I get stun at least once every other fight. |
Hehe, I mentioned it, along with some sort of plug in nearly every other thread, especially about how much I like it.
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NinjaBurger
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 01 Sep 2003
Posts: 2800
Location: St. Louis
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Posted: 02/05/05 - 09:58 Post subject:
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For PvP, mace spec is garbage. By the time you're down to mace spec, you've missed broke ass Seal Fate, and you miss spamming 5 pt. Eviscs~
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khrath
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 8750
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Posted: 02/05/05 - 10:14 Post subject:
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most of those extra specs in combat are half useless anyways.
I meant sticking with daggers for ambush crits versus sustained damage from swords and/or maces.
I got it all figured out tho now
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Jinu
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 2396
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Posted: 02/05/05 - 14:32 Post subject:
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| NinjaBurger wrote: | | For PvP, mace spec is garbage. By the time you're down to mace spec, you've missed broke ass Seal Fate, and you miss spamming 5 pt. Eviscs~ |
Huh? I'm on PvP and I rarely lose a PvP fight to another player around my level.
And they'll eventually fix Seal Fate, so why depend on a bug.
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Malodious
Toomuchtimeonhands
Joined: 02 May 2003
Posts: 991
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Posted: 02/05/05 - 15:02 Post subject:
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| Jinu wrote: | | NinjaBurger wrote: | | For PvP, mace spec is garbage. By the time you're down to mace spec, you've missed broke ass Seal Fate, and you miss spamming 5 pt. Eviscs~ |
Huh? I'm on PvP and I rarely lose a PvP fight to another player around my level.
And they'll eventually fix Seal Fate, so why depend on a bug. |
Because even if they fix it, it's still going to be a exceptional ability with the right build. It's just nuts in it's current bugged form though.
I dont think it's depending on a bug if you realize that it's just that, a bug, and it will be fixed.
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Fever
Rookie
Joined: 21 Oct 2002
Posts: 72
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Posted: 02/06/05 - 10:53 Post subject:
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almost any rogue build works, just depends on what you want.swords/maces/dagger all have their uses.in pvp sword/mace is a much better combo vs high armor, dagger is better for casters.im dagger and have a extremely hard time with paladins, my guildmate is pure combat/swords and has almost no prob with them, he has a much harder time with casters because he dosent have that massive stealth damage.
dagger is flakey tho, iv killed a lv 60 caster in 3 hits on the other hand iv had to chase one all over because i just was not criting any.
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NinjaBurger
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 01 Sep 2003
Posts: 2800
Location: St. Louis
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Posted: 02/06/05 - 11:08 Post subject:
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| Jinu wrote: | | NinjaBurger wrote: | | For PvP, mace spec is garbage. By the time you're down to mace spec, you've missed broke ass Seal Fate, and you miss spamming 5 pt. Eviscs~ |
Huh? I'm on PvP and I rarely lose a PvP fight to another player around my level.
And they'll eventually fix Seal Fate, so why depend on a bug. |
The problem with Combat build is that you lose out on the DPS spikes. You get some respectable sustained DPS, but you don't get the "Oh wow, I have a 100% chance of burning a crit 5 pt. Evisc!" (Provided it doesn't miss.)
Don't get me wrong, combat is great for leveling up and PvE maybe, but you're going to start noticing later on that controlled burst DPS >>>>> sustained.
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GruntingCod
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 6399
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Posted: 02/06/05 - 16:17 Post subject:
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| NinjaBurger wrote: | | Jinu wrote: | | NinjaBurger wrote: | | For PvP, mace spec is garbage. By the time you're down to mace spec, you've missed broke ass Seal Fate, and you miss spamming 5 pt. Eviscs~ |
Huh? I'm on PvP and I rarely lose a PvP fight to another player around my level.
And they'll eventually fix Seal Fate, so why depend on a bug. |
The problem with Combat build is that you lose out on the DPS spikes. You get some respectable sustained DPS, but you don't get the "Oh wow, I have a 100% chance of burning a crit 5 pt. Evisc!" (Provided it doesn't miss.)
Don't get me wrong, combat is great for leveling up and PvE maybe, but you're going to start noticing later on that controlled burst DPS >>>>> sustained. |
Depends on if it is PvP or not honestly. With Remorsless I crit 60% of the time after every kill on my first SS, which is always over 400 damage with my mainhand mace. But yet again, compaired to a backstab (W/ shanker) or ambush (W/ Shanker) that 400 crit more than half the time to begin the battle is nothing.
P.S. I didn't read your last paragraph untill I was finished typing this. BUT, I do not agree with you when saying we are only "maybe" good at pve. We are *easily*, better than daggers at PvP, swords or maces easily.
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NinjaBurger
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 01 Sep 2003
Posts: 2800
Location: St. Louis
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Posted: 02/06/05 - 17:15 Post subject:
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No way in hell is a dagger spec with equal weapons better than a mace/sword spec. Seal Fate is just ungodly when complemented by the 30% modifier for backstab, and the 45% modifier on Ambush is just gravy.
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Jinu
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 2396
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Posted: 02/08/05 - 18:05 Post subject:
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I guess it's a difference in taste. I'm not a big fan of ganking, and rather stand toe to toe to someone.
In the combat tree, I get Improved Gouge, Kick (awesome for casters), Blade Flurry (great pve or pvp), evasion and Aggression.
Is it better than another build? Maybe not, but it better suits my play style and I also have a macro to shoot Blade Flurry and Evasion at the start of any PvP fight, so that usually gets me through ok.
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