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Gethy
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 5595
Location: Tallahassee, FL
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 Posted: 01/05/04 - 17:47 Post subject: My problem with Square these days.
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Not only are their storylines becoming increasingly carbon copied (not that the average RPG was ever all too original), but whoever is in charge of character design must be masturbating as much as I do, because I, for the life of me, can barely differenciate between any of these main characters; they look so god darn the same, I ask them if they want ice cream cone--they all say yes--what in the hell.
Are they quality, playable games? Sure. I can't contest Square's ability to make a game I don't mind sitting through, but I am saying they've lost their touch. And, truthfully, it's not their fault; there's only so much life that can be breathed into a series (even if the series has absolutely no continuity).
It's apparent these days more and more. An FF sequel (with the focal point of girlpower!), pairing up (and merging) with other companies (Disney, Enix), a movie set on Earth, and a TV series on par with Digimon or Pokemon or whatnot (not sure how much Square had to do with it, just know it brandished the FF name).
Is it a big deal? Nah. I just remember being a tot and playing through something awesome like Final Fantasy. Are kids enamoured by FFX-2 like I was with FF? Most probably. Would I trade places with 'em? Not ever.
They've lost innovation, now they're just floundering for ideas and their quality control has severely disappaited. But, hey, they're still making more money than they ever did before. Go them!
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Spink
RealPoor Sensei
Joined: 16 Oct 2002
Posts: 1599
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Posted: 01/05/04 - 17:54 Post subject:
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I like FFXI, does it count?
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Gethy
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 5595
Location: Tallahassee, FL
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Posted: 01/05/04 - 18:04 Post subject:
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Haven't played it yet. But, hey, saturating the MMO market isn't a bad thing.
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NinjaBurger
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 01 Sep 2003
Posts: 2800
Location: St. Louis
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Posted: 01/05/04 - 21:57 Post subject:
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Agreed.
Kids need more stuff like FF4 which doesn't hold your hand through shit.
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Silvermouse
RealPoor Jedi
Joined: 12 Oct 2002
Posts: 11015
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Posted: 01/05/04 - 22:03 Post subject:
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What they need is a really dark FF game to get us back on track. Something more along the lines of FF2(4), my favorite of the series. Drop the cute guy who is girlish enough that straight men would f**k him, drop the love story between him (an outsider) and the kind-hearted woman who no real woman would ever be able to live up to.
I've said it before: I'd rather play a character like Auron, who just grunts and drops 99999's on everything that gets in the way.
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GruntingCod
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 6399
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Posted: 01/05/04 - 22:58 Post subject:
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I don't know about you guys, but I thought Kingdom Hearts is one of the best games I have ever played and I am 23.
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Gethy
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 5595
Location: Tallahassee, FL
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Posted: 01/06/04 - 01:15 Post subject:
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| GruntingCod wrote: | | I don't know about you guys, but I thought Kingdom Hearts is one of the best games I have ever played and I am 23. |
It was a good game, that's why. It was well-made and enjoyable--there's no contesting that, unless you absolutely cannot tolerate Disney in your RPG. It even had a bit of originality, but that originality was so wholly artificial; it felt like one big advertisement to me, nothing even close to something that Square (and, hell, even Disney) used to have: innovation.
So it was fun to hack and slash thru KH--lots of games can claim that. But Sora is nothing more than the carbon copied replica of Tidus (..or Squall.. or Cloud..). Was it fun to run through the streets of Agrabah? Sure. Was it the same as venturing through Kefka's tower the first time? Hell no.
There's no denying their ability to make a fun, playable game.
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halfbent
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 2944
Location: Kentwood, Mi
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Posted: 01/06/04 - 01:41 Post subject:
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Wasn't Sora suppose to be a sort of amalgam of all the recent FF leads? I thought I read something like that in an interview.
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Prawn
Toomuchtimeonhands
Joined: 13 Oct 2002
Posts: 825
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Posted: 01/06/04 - 08:58 Post subject:
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Honestly, the last FF game to truely hold my attention plotwise was FFVII, not including Tactics. Square seems to have lost its focus a bit, going from true entertainment to eyecandy over the last few years. I couldn't bare to sit through FFVIII, especially having seen the whole lovestory-in-space shit while my little brother played, FFIX just, well, scared me, FFX I admit, was looking up, it gave me more hope in Squares doings (Mainly because of Auron and Kumari) then I saw X-2 and wanted to slap someone until their at home geisha wife felt it.
I liked the darkness in final fantasy games, I loved the fact that the characters at time felt truely hopeless, that events were gripping, opposed to huge CG fight scenes. I liked feeling horrible as Cyan fell apart, I liked seeing Kain go insane due to unrequented love and an inferiority complex, and I felt for Dyne when he saw Barret, a lifelong friend who had left him for dead, with nothing but vengeance in his eyes.
Clouds Breakdown, Celes' confusion, Cecils growth and self assesment, were captivating stories. Sure they all held lovestories, but they didn't dwell on them, they weren't like reading cheesey romance novels. There were hidden side stories, reasons for everything, f**k I got depressed after seeing RedXIII's history. These things lead me to play a game, ignorant of the sometimes irritating random battles, and esper and materia growth, because like with good novels, you expect to give yourself a bit of time to complete them, you become absorbed in the story, and the little things that aren't quite perfect seem to fall away.
Now, now I get to see J-rockers fight evil goth opera singers for control of a world with two moons, cause the kids like two moons, fat whale things in dresses, a surfer torn from the beaches of miami to avenge his father, and now a couple dress up dolls do whatever it is the plot of FFX-2 requires so that depraved, overweight, unintelligent social rejects can wank over polygons.
There's hope though, because Enix has entered the equation, a company that's never, ever had flashy graphics in their games, the company responsible for the Dragonquest Series, and Ogrebattle. I just hope they aren't persuaded to release Ogrebattle:9 The Black Queens Wardrobe or some rediculous shit. On top of that, there are undertones surfacing in things such as the current kiddy-ish Tactics Advance that lead me to believe Square's getting the point ("Why?? Why do you want to hurt the Prince like this?" "So I can go home" "And why is going home so important?" "I don't know..." Yay sadism!)
We need another dark story from Square, and really, that's what's brought Squaresoft success, games like Secret of Mana (Beat the game, it's cute, but there's a pretty large fill of story, death, vengeance, lost love, and sacrafice) Final Fantasy Tactics (Winner in my eyes of the best FF plot of all time) and Final Fantasy 6 and 7 (both pushing the limits at the time, but not trading plot for visuals) and I'm hoping, eventually we'll get it, waiting's just been a pain in the ass. Square initially strayed from the fairytale fantasy, which made it so easy to be drawn into the world of Final Fantasy. There was pain, things occured throughout the plots that left me as a child thinking "That was wrong, that shouldn't happen", there were elements of harsh reality that made believing in the game so much easier to do, and that's what Squares been lacking lately, fantastic realism.
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Callaren
RealPoor Sensei
Joined: 03 Dec 2003
Posts: 1598
Location: South Jersey
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Posted: 01/06/04 - 09:33 Post subject:
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| Silvermouse wrote: | | I've said it before: I'd rather play a character like Auron, who just grunts and drops 99999's on everything that gets in the way. |
/agree totally
Auron is a favorite of mine.
A TON of names and characters are recycled throughout the series and if they're trying to make it a trademark then it's not such a good idea. Non-main characters with reused names like Cid are okay, but there's no reason for main characters to look alike or even have the same names unless it's FFX and FFX-2.
The thing that's really only been changing is the level-up system and storyline, which have been doing good IMO.
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Jakanden
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 11 Nov 2003
Posts: 5334
Location: Fuck if I know - I am always lost
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Posted: 01/06/04 - 09:36 Post subject:
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Im also getting sick of the chipper androgenous male leads. Cecil is still the best main character of ANY FF and they should have more characters like him.
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Mogling
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 29 Dec 2002
Posts: 2451
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Posted: 01/06/04 - 15:33 Post subject:
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FFX-2 has more time sinks then lulcin :\
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Gethy
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 5595
Location: Tallahassee, FL
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Posted: 01/07/04 - 01:28 Post subject:
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| Mogling wrote: | | FFX-2 has more time sinks then lulcin :\ |
A time sink in a console game is just one more step closer towards total retardation than EQ.
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Mogling
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 29 Dec 2002
Posts: 2451
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Posted: 01/07/04 - 02:49 Post subject:
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sad thing is its true  there are only like 14 storyline missions and a ton of gimpy sidequest ones, like talk to the old guy and dont interupt him! yay!
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Fever
Rookie
Joined: 21 Oct 2002
Posts: 72
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Posted: 01/07/04 - 11:15 Post subject:
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watch 40 mins of com sphere footage, chap 4 was horrid if you wanted the 100% complete
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NinjaBurger
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 01 Sep 2003
Posts: 2800
Location: St. Louis
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Posted: 01/07/04 - 18:52 Post subject:
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| Prawn wrote: | On top of that, there are undertones surfacing in things such as the current kiddy-ish Tactics Advance that lead me to believe Square's getting the point ("Why?? Why do you want to hurt the Prince like this?" "So I can go home" "And why is going home so important?" "I don't know..." Yay sadism!)
We need another dark story from Square, and really, that's what's brought Squaresoft success, games like Secret of Mana (Beat the game, it's cute, but there's a pretty large fill of story, death, vengeance, lost love, and sacrafice) Final Fantasy Tactics (Winner in my eyes of the best FF plot of all time) and Final Fantasy 6 and 7 (both pushing the limits at the time, but not trading plot for visuals) and I'm hoping, eventually we'll get it, waiting's just been a pain in the ass. Square initially strayed from the fairytale fantasy, which made it so easy to be drawn into the world of Final Fantasy. There was pain, things occured throughout the plots that left me as a child thinking "That was wrong, that shouldn't happen", there were elements of harsh reality that made believing in the game so much easier to do, and that's what Squares been lacking lately, fantastic realism. |
Excuse my noob, but what's the main differences between FFT and FFTA?
And what we need is like FFIV-2
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Gethy
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 5595
Location: Tallahassee, FL
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Posted: 01/07/04 - 18:57 Post subject:
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| Mogling wrote: | | sad thing is its true there are only like 14 storyline missions and a ton of gimpy sidequest ones, like talk to the old guy and dont interupt him! yay! |
Dude, I could totally understand the timesinks, even, if the game had a respectable storyline and any vestige of innovation; it just doesn't.
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Gethy
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 5595
Location: Tallahassee, FL
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Posted: 01/07/04 - 19:05 Post subject:
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| NinjaBurger wrote: | | Prawn wrote: | On top of that, there are undertones surfacing in things such as the current kiddy-ish Tactics Advance that lead me to believe Square's getting the point ("Why?? Why do you want to hurt the Prince like this?" "So I can go home" "And why is going home so important?" "I don't know..." Yay sadism!)
We need another dark story from Square, and really, that's what's brought Squaresoft success, games like Secret of Mana (Beat the game, it's cute, but there's a pretty large fill of story, death, vengeance, lost love, and sacrafice) Final Fantasy Tactics (Winner in my eyes of the best FF plot of all time) and Final Fantasy 6 and 7 (both pushing the limits at the time, but not trading plot for visuals) and I'm hoping, eventually we'll get it, waiting's just been a pain in the ass. Square initially strayed from the fairytale fantasy, which made it so easy to be drawn into the world of Final Fantasy. There was pain, things occured throughout the plots that left me as a child thinking "That was wrong, that shouldn't happen", there were elements of harsh reality that made believing in the game so much easier to do, and that's what Squares been lacking lately, fantastic realism. |
Excuse my noob, but what's the main differences between FFT and FFTA?
And what we need is like FFIV-2 |
FFT and FFTA are two completely different games.
FFT follows Ramza Beoulve through Ivalice (NOT the Ivalice of FFTA or FFXII; think chocobos, moogles and cid... now add Ivalice to that list) as its going through an era following the 100 Year War, The Lion Wars. It's a war story with a great plot (and those religious undertones that were being heavily scrutinized at the time; see: Xenogears), we just got an asstastic translation here in America.
FFTA is its own game, and, uh, I didn't care much for the "holy geez, how did I get in this new world!"-style approach, but it most definitely didn't ruin it for me. FFTA is less driven by storyline and more mission-based.
And what we really need is for Namco/Monolith's next Xeno release to NOT suck.
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NinjaBurger
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 01 Sep 2003
Posts: 2800
Location: St. Louis
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Posted: 01/07/04 - 20:37 Post subject:
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Oh I thought that FFTA = Port of FFT =/
Never play FFT...guess I should.
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Yanbik
RealPoor Sensei
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 1575
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Posted: 01/07/04 - 21:36 Post subject:
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kingdom hearts needed to be multiplayer like secret of mana
so does kingdom hearts 2
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Gethy
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 5595
Location: Tallahassee, FL
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Posted: 01/07/04 - 23:27 Post subject:
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| NinjaBurger wrote: | Oh I thought that FFTA = Port of FFT =/
Never play FFT...guess I should. |
Do yourself a favor. Then play Xenogears if you missed that.
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Gethy
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 5595
Location: Tallahassee, FL
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Posted: 01/07/04 - 23:28 Post subject:
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| Yanbik wrote: | kingdom hearts needed to be multiplayer like secret of mana
so does kingdom hearts 2 |
I agree. I thought the inability to switch from Sora/Donald/Goofy was fairly retarded as well.
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GruntingCod
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 6399
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Posted: 01/07/04 - 23:38 Post subject:
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But a feature like that would be impossible without f*****g the game over when not playing Sora.
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Palinstorm
Rookie
Joined: 06 May 2003
Posts: 54
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Posted: 01/08/04 - 00:06 Post subject:
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yes play FFT and then Xenogears (which used to be hard as hell to get but easy now that it has been re released as a greatest hit)
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Silvermouse
RealPoor Jedi
Joined: 12 Oct 2002
Posts: 11015
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Posted: 01/08/04 - 01:50 Post subject:
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Meanwhile, FF2(4) got brutal on it's re-release. The monsters are relentless and when you get first strike, you get 1 hit and then all the monsters go, they are so fast.
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Gethy
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 5595
Location: Tallahassee, FL
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Posted: 01/08/04 - 14:35 Post subject:
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| Silvermouse wrote: | | Meanwhile, FF2(4) got brutal on it's re-release. The monsters are relentless and when you get first strike, you get 1 hit and then all the monsters go, they are so fast. |
I believe they released the original Japanese version; HT (hardtype). I could be wrong here, though. The original US release of FFIV was dumbed down for American audiences; items were left out, certain skills were left out (Dark Wave, Remember, etc.), there was one general esuna item and not specific items for each ailment.
It's kinda nice getting a version that doesn't suck.
Oh! And they explain the relation between Cecil and Kain a tad more indepth.
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Nahualli
RealPoor Master of Posts
Joined: 11 Oct 2002
Posts: 8461
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Posted: 01/08/04 - 15:03 Post subject:
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Gethy the Ivalice of FFT and FFXII are the same. Different era tho. I just read it in the last EGM they were interviewing the producer of the game. He was the producer of FFT as well, it sorta makes sense.
You are correct tho FFTA is not the same Ivalice as the other 2.
Cecil was a great character until he got his iridescent technicolor afro. It was all downhill from there.
I like FF-X2 but the flavor of girl power in that one is a bit much as opposed to, say, the girl power of Celes Chere in FF III American.
I wanted to shake Celes' hand.. I wanted to rip Yuna's off.
-Nah-
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Tiluvas
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 19 Oct 2002
Posts: 2355
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Posted: 01/08/04 - 15:08 Post subject:
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http://members.fortunecity.com/sephkatana/FF2stuff/ff2change.txt
In FF4, there is a "programmer's room" located below "Pub Laliho" in the dwarf castle. In this room, you could talk to (and fight!) some of the programmers, and there is some strange stuff down there like the Porno book. This room was taken out of the US FF2, probably so you can't get access to the Porno Book.
Hehe, that's pretty funny.
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Mogling
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 29 Dec 2002
Posts: 2451
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Posted: 01/08/04 - 15:47 Post subject:
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Actuly from what I remember, there were 2 releeases of FF4 in Japan, Hard Type and Eeasy Type, thee easy one is the one that got ported.
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NinjaBurger
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 01 Sep 2003
Posts: 2800
Location: St. Louis
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Posted: 01/08/04 - 20:40 Post subject:
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| Gethy wrote: | | Silvermouse wrote: | | Meanwhile, FF2(4) got brutal on it's re-release. The monsters are relentless and when you get first strike, you get 1 hit and then all the monsters go, they are so fast. |
I believe they released the original Japanese version; HT (hardtype). I could be wrong here, though. The original US release of FFIV was dumbed down for American audiences; items were left out, certain skills were left out (Dark Wave, Remember, etc.), there was one general esuna item and not specific items for each ailment.
It's kinda nice getting a version that doesn't suck.
Oh! And they explain the relation between Cecil and Kain a tad more indepth. |
Correct.
They gimped the game down because before it was still mainly children playing games.
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