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Kilzalot
RealPoor Guru

Joined: 21 Oct 2002 Posts: 2080
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Posted: 12/21/04 - 21:38 Post subject: Mom sues Wal-Mart...
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... cause her daughter was nuts and offed herself.
http://www.cnn.com/2004/LAW/12/21/gun.lawsuit.ap/index.html
| Quote: | DALLAS, Texas (AP) -- Near the end of her short life, Shayla Stewart, a diagnosed manic-depressive and schizophrenic, assaulted police officers and was arrested for attacking a fellow customer at a Denton Wal-Mart where she had a prescription for anti-psychotic medication.
Given all those signs, her parents say, another Wal-Mart just seven miles away should have never sold her the shotgun she used to kill herself at age 24 in 2003.
Her mother, Lavern Bracy, is suing the world's biggest store chain for $25 million, saying clerks should have known about her daughter's illness or done more to find out.
The case, filed earlier this month, has reignited a debate over the confidentiality of mental health records and the effectiveness of background checks on would-be buyers of guns.
"We know that if they had so much as said, `Why do you want this?' we would not be having this conversation because Shayla would have had a meltdown," said her stepfather, Garrett Bracy.
The Bracys said Wal-Mart's gun department could have checked Wal-Mart's own security files or the pharmacy department's prescription records before selling her the weapon.
Wal-Mart spokeswoman Christi Gallagher declined to comment on the lawsuit.
But pharmacy prescription records are confidential under a 1996 federal law, so stores cannot use them when deciding whether to sell a gun.
Also, Wal-Mart did a background check on Stewart, as required under federal law, but through no fault of its own, her name did not show up in the FBI database. The reason: The database contains no mental health records from Texas and 37 other states.
Texas does not submit mental health records because state law deems them confidential, said Paul Mascot, an attorney with the Texas Department of State Health Services. Other states have not computerized their record-keeping systems or do not store them in a central location for use by the FBI.
Federal law prohibits stores from selling guns to people who, like Stewart, have a history of serious mental illness.
Would-be buyers must fill out a form that asks about mental health. Stewart, who had been involuntarily committed to an institution and declared dangerously mentally ill by a judge, lied on that form, according to her mother's attorney's office. Wal-Mart ran a background check anyway, as required by federal law.
Michael Faenza, president and chief executive of the National Mental Health Association, applauds Texas' refusal to share information with the FBI database. He said it would not be fair to violate patients' privacy when there is no data to support claims that mentally ill people are more violent than others.
"The tragedies that families face when people are killed is terrible. And frankly I wish handguns were not so available in this country," he said. "But it's not right, in our minds, to make social policy based on just a few cases."
Garrett Bracy couldn't disagree more.
He and his wife watched his stepdaughter's six-year decline from straight-A high school student to violent and unpredictable stranger. She was hospitalized five times, twice under court orders. Her longest hospitalization, lasting a month, came in 2002 after she refused to leave her room or take her medication.
The suggestion that Wal-Mart should have checked prescription records infuriates Erich Pratt, a spokesman for the Virginia-based group Gun Owners of America.
"Does that mean mental illness prevents everyone on Prozac from owning a gun? Or women with PMS?" he said.
Rep. Carolyn McCarthy, D-New York, who ran for Congress after her husband was killed and son wounded in 1993 by a gunman on a Long Island Rail Road train, wants to strengthen the federal background check system by encouraging states to share mental health records. She has introduced legislation that would give states grants to automate and turn over the information.
She drafted the bill after a priest and a parishioner were shot to death by a schizophrenic man in a New York church in 2002. He, too, should not have been allowed to buy a gun.
"When you see these deaths that could have been prevented it's a shame," McCarthy said.
As the Bracys prepare for another Christmas without their daughter, they are urging lawmakers to support McCarthy's bill and dealers to conduct their own background checks.
"Lavern went to the store the other day to buy over-the-counter headache sinus medication and they limited the amount of sinus medication she could buy at one time," her husband said, his voice trembling with emotion. "But Shayla can walk into a store and buy a gun and they could care less. That's got to change."
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Nictathan
RealPoor Master of Posts

Joined: 11 Oct 2002 Posts: 5531
Location: here... where I am... not with you
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Posted: 12/21/04 - 21:42 Post subject:
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WAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
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wellspoken
RealPoor Master of Posts

Joined: 01 Feb 2003 Posts: 7137
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Posted: 12/21/04 - 22:05 Post subject:
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Shotgun, bet that was probably a closed casket.
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Zwadrich
RealPoor Master of Posts

Joined: 12 Oct 2002 Posts: 5015
Location: The Netherlands
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Posted: 12/21/04 - 22:14 Post subject:
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what the f**k they sell guns at f*****g Walmarts?
You Americans are insane.
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wellspoken
RealPoor Master of Posts

Joined: 01 Feb 2003 Posts: 7137
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Posted: 12/21/04 - 22:28 Post subject:
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| Zwadrich wrote: | what the f**k they sell guns at f*****g Walmarts?
You Americans are insane. |
yes and there is no waiting period or anything.
gotta love the usa.
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Zuldane
RealPoor Guru

Joined: 11 Oct 2002 Posts: 4057
Location: At sea.
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Posted: 12/21/04 - 23:14 Post subject:
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HI WANT A GUN?
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wellspoken
RealPoor Master of Posts

Joined: 01 Feb 2003 Posts: 7137
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Posted: 12/21/04 - 23:20 Post subject:
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| Zuldane wrote: | | HI WANT A GUN? |
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principessa
RealPoor Guru

Joined: 11 Oct 2002 Posts: 3149
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Posted: 12/21/04 - 23:24 Post subject:
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Welcome to the south
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kbarr
RealPoor Jedi

Joined: 05 Oct 2004 Posts: 11239
Location: New York, now go fuck off...
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Posted: 12/21/04 - 23:28 Post subject:
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| Zwadrich wrote: | what the f**k they sell guns at f*****g Walmarts?
You Americans are insane. |
Good prices too. I just got a 14 gun Sentry safe there for $329.00. Walmart is the best place to go to gear up during hunting season.
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Nictathan
RealPoor Master of Posts

Joined: 11 Oct 2002 Posts: 5531
Location: here... where I am... not with you
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Posted: 12/21/04 - 23:30 Post subject:
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I want to get a shotgun to go trap shooting... used to be good at it and then my dad stopped going so I never got to do it anymore
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Overon
RealPoor Guru

Joined: 14 Oct 2002 Posts: 3602
Location: PLANE OF PIXIES
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Posted: 12/22/04 - 01:18 Post subject:
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lol guns at walmart
i bet they are next to the kids toys section
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Kilzalot
RealPoor Guru

Joined: 21 Oct 2002 Posts: 2080
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Posted: 12/22/04 - 01:19 Post subject:
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| Overon wrote: | lol guns at walmart
i bet they are next to the kids toys section |
Actually....
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Spiritz
RealPoor Sensei

Joined: 11 Oct 2002 Posts: 1969
Location: Huntington Beach, CA
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Posted: 12/22/04 - 01:31 Post subject:
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They are.
BTW Kilz loves Wal-Mart.
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Kilzalot
RealPoor Guru

Joined: 21 Oct 2002 Posts: 2080
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Posted: 12/22/04 - 01:32 Post subject:
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yes =/
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Ciladar
RealPoor Guru

Joined: 15 Oct 2002 Posts: 3765
Location: Northern New Jersey
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Posted: 12/22/04 - 02:14 Post subject:
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I despise everything Wal-Mart...yet they do have basically everything in their stores
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Yellow Journalist
RealPoor Sensei

Joined: 20 Oct 2002 Posts: 1973
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Posted: 12/22/04 - 08:48 Post subject:
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Wal Mart blows... dont get me started ..
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Paco
RealPoor Jedi

Joined: 13 Oct 2002 Posts: 12939
Location: Jacksonville, FL
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Posted: 12/22/04 - 09:27 Post subject:
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Betcha she doesn't get a dime too.
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cheese
Luke Warm

Joined: 08 Dec 2004 Posts: 241
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Posted: 12/22/04 - 09:58 Post subject:
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| Zwadrich wrote: | what the f**k they sell guns at f*****g Walmarts?
You Americans are insane. |
Canada too. The Wal-mart in Montreal has guns... I didn't think they would sell them, but when I was there they had them...
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sinrakin
RealPoor Master of Posts

Joined: 11 Oct 2002 Posts: 7044
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Posted: 12/22/04 - 10:19 Post subject:
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This is stupid; that family shouldn't get a dime. I don't like Walmart, but they acted completely appropriately. They did what they were supposed to do.
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Ishmobbin
( . )( . )'s Are Fun!
Joined: 09 Oct 2002 Posts: 1264
Location: Texas
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Posted: 12/22/04 - 10:43 Post subject:
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sounds like walmart did them a favor by selling her a gun. They would prolly spend less money on her funeral than everything else for the rest of her life.
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motherface
RealPoor Guru

Joined: 12 Mar 2003 Posts: 3407
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Posted: 12/22/04 - 11:22 Post subject:
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| Quote: | | "Does that mean mental illness prevents everyone on Prozac from owning a gun? Or women with PMS?" he said. |
Line of the year!
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flikker
Luke Warm

Joined: 22 Jan 2003 Posts: 199
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Posted: 12/22/04 - 12:04 Post subject:
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It is a shame when people desperately seek to lay blame other than on themselves. Obviously, Ms. Bracy is not very realistic. She expects store clerks in another Wal-Mart to be aware of her daughter's illness. Come on! $7.00/ hour clerks typically have a hard enough time keeping up with their own weekly work schedules, much less some obscure dispute in another facility. I mean have you ever seen one of them looking like a monkey doing a math problem because an item is not ringing up from scanning. It is apparent to me that Ms. Bracy was the most aware of her daughter's illness, if she wants to place blame maybe she should do some soul searching of her own. Where the f**k was she when her daughter was buying a shot gun and proceeding with making her head a canoe? thing that sucks is that in the end she will probably get 100 to 200k out of this because wal-mart will settle out of court because it is more cost efficient and creates less negative publicity for them and 200k is not shit for the wal-mart corporation, and I am betting that is a sizeable amount for anyone living in the Denton area with a name like Lavern. Of course, we probably will not hear about it because I am sure Wal-Mart will require the settlement tol be conditional of a non-disclosure agreement.
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Sutto
Sir Postalot

Joined: 18 Oct 2002 Posts: 1100
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Posted: 12/22/04 - 12:33 Post subject:
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yes most wal-marts place their gun section right next to the male kids toys ie ninja turtles, gi joes ect, next isle over, air riflesl, paintball guns, next isle over shotguns, rifles
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Leilu
Sir Postalot

Joined: 12 Nov 2002 Posts: 1164
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Posted: 12/22/04 - 12:36 Post subject:
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I hate WalMart, but it IS the only place that stocks Red Ryder BB guns. I went last night and got one! And was continuosly reminded the entire time I was in there why I stopped going.
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Brael
RealPoor Guru

Joined: 11 Oct 2002 Posts: 2122
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Posted: 12/22/04 - 12:41 Post subject:
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| Sutto wrote: | | yes most wal-marts place their gun section right next to the male kids toys ie ninja turtles, gi joes ect, next isle over, air riflesl, paintball guns, next isle over shotguns, rifles |
The one here places it next to their bikes, roughly 2 isles over from the toy section.
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sinrakin
RealPoor Master of Posts

Joined: 11 Oct 2002 Posts: 7044
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Posted: 12/22/04 - 12:50 Post subject:
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I've only ever been in a Walmart once. It reminded me of Kmart, but worse. And I ordered some stuff online from them last Christmas since Toyrus was out of stock.
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ATM Banana
RealPoor Master of Posts

Joined: 02 Jan 2003 Posts: 8575
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Posted: 12/22/04 - 13:03 Post subject:
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god bless amerigo vespucci
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lauren000
RealPoor Guru

Joined: 21 Oct 2002 Posts: 3510
Location: colorado springs
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Posted: 12/22/04 - 13:56 Post subject:
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mental health records should be kept confidential, and past mental health history shouldn't be used as a reason to bar people from owning a gun. It's a tragedy, but it shouldn't be used as an excuse to tear down the rights of the mentally ill.
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sinrakin
RealPoor Master of Posts

Joined: 11 Oct 2002 Posts: 7044
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Posted: 12/22/04 - 13:59 Post subject:
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| lauren000 wrote: | | mental health records should be kept confidential, and past mental health history shouldn't be used as a reason to bar people from owning a gun. It's a tragedy, but it shouldn't be used as an excuse to tear down the rights of the mentally ill. |
I sympathize with your point, but somehow I think arguing for the right of the mentally ill to own guns is going to be an uphill battle. Although I'll bet you could get NRA support.
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lauren000
RealPoor Guru

Joined: 21 Oct 2002 Posts: 3510
Location: colorado springs
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Posted: 12/22/04 - 14:10 Post subject:
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| sinrakin wrote: | | lauren000 wrote: | | mental health records should be kept confidential, and past mental health history shouldn't be used as a reason to bar people from owning a gun. It's a tragedy, but it shouldn't be used as an excuse to tear down the rights of the mentally ill. |
I sympathize with your point, but somehow I think arguing for the right of the mentally ill to own guns is going to be an uphill battle. Although I'll bet you could get NRA support. |
the truth is there is a stigma surounding the mentally ill, and there are way different interpretations of what makes someone mentally ill. Schizophrenics who take their medication often are no different than anyone else, so why should they not be allowed to own guns? Why should some d*****t store clerk be able to know the person is schizophrenic? We have privacy laws for a reason, people shouldn't have to disclose their mental health history under any circumstance. The only justifiable reason to view a person's mental health history should be for the military or for security related jobs.
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