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Spitulski
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 23 Nov 2002
Posts: 4344
Location: Washington
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 Posted: 10/13/03 - 08:59 Post subject: Looking to build an audiophile-level car stereo system
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Rather than rice my car out and spend a few grand putting a turbo in it, I want to build one hell of a system. I kinda have some starting points, but for the audiophiles (if any) here, I have a few questions -
Amps that have power ratings at 2,4 ohms...what's the differents between the ohmage?
Would it be wise to buy a higher quality 2 channel amp and run one channel to subs and the other to the speakers, or wiser to buy two seperate lower quality amps?
Any recommendations on a very well defined sub? I don't want loud, I want definition and depth. I plan on having a DVD reciever in the car, so something that represents an actual theater sub instead of a massive SPL sub would be perfect.
Any other tips would be hella helpful. Thanks!
Edit: Probably should throw in what I'm considering in case it needs to be tweaked. I have space for front component 6.5"/1" tweets, rear 6.5"s, two 10" subs. Was looking at a center channel to go with the DVD thought, not sure on that. As far as DVD players, the Clarion top unit looks most appealing and for the components, the MB Quarts were looking nice as well.
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Xarpolis
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 15 Oct 2002
Posts: 2884
Location: Philly, PA
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Posted: 10/13/03 - 09:17 Post subject:
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Well sir, In 14 days I leave for Toronto to goto school for this sort of thing... I'll be able to answer all the questions you want then, but right now I have uneducated opinions and what have you! Anyway... I don't understand ohm's at all really.
As for your internal speaker amp, I'd get a single (high quality) multi channel amp. Sure it's gonna cost you a healthy chunk of change, but it'll be worth it for SQ.
As for subs, it really depends how much you're looking to spend. They have amazing subs out there that are VERY accurate, even if they're only 10", but they're pricey. An example of that sub would be the JL 10" w7. it's like $500+ for it in stores. you can get it for less online though.
The next problem though is what are you gonig to do for an enclosure? Sealed is your best bet for a SQ system, as it's tighter hitting base. More in line with what a theater has. Are you going to build your own, or get one from somewhere else? Here's a good (sub) bet.
a JL 10w7 sub. a JL 500/1 amp to power it.
That's exactly what the sub needs.
for an enclosure, JL says this is you're best bet for a sealed system.
Recommended Sealed Volume: 1.25 cu. ft. (35.4 ltrs.)
You're best bet for that would be to buy a JL CLS110RG-W7 enlcosure.
it's a w7 "ProWedge" sealed box, that's designed especially for the 10w7.
So yeah... that's all I have time to tell you about now. I'll talk more soon ^
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Spitulski
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 23 Nov 2002
Posts: 4344
Location: Washington
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Posted: 10/13/03 - 09:26 Post subject:
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Right on Xarp, thanks for your post.
I was actually looking at a w7, but was unsure of how to mount it in my trunk. I've worked a lot with MDF, body filler and a little bit with fiberglass and was toying with the option of building a really solid display to mount the sub, amps and capacitor in. If I mounted the wedge in the center of my trunk, would I be able to lock it down to the bottom of my trunk and build a steel reinforced extension on both sides of it for amps and such?
Also, any opinion on Focal speakers? Was doing some research and they came up as being better balanced speakers with the W7 than the Quarts were.
Thanks again =).
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Cyklops
Total Newbie
Joined: 13 Oct 2002
Posts: 25
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Posted: 10/13/03 - 12:26 Post subject:
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These Audiobahn subs are probably the best sounding (and hardest hitting) subs i've used. Although I use 12" subs, im sure these are just as good. I would definatly look on ebay though for your purchases, there are alot of good sellers with much better prices then you'll find in any online store.
On the amp issue, I prefer a seperate mono amp for my subs for a little more control on frequency range sent to the subs. I like the deeper sounding bass so I think for what your going for a good dual-channel amp would probably work best. And it's less wires to run 
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Xrantix
Total Newbie
Joined: 14 Oct 2002
Posts: 34
Location: Colorado
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Posted: 10/13/03 - 12:55 Post subject:
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www.fusioncaraudio.com
Fusion Jonah Lomu 10" Sub
www.logicsoundlab.com
Logic Sound Lab EX 10" Sub
www.lanzar.com
Optidrive 1000.1D
Perfect amp for either of the subs, 1 per sub
and an infinity kappa perfect comonent system with kappa three ways if you need 6 x 9s no questions asked
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Syke
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 12 Oct 2002
Posts: 2976
Location: Huntington Beach, CA
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Posted: 10/13/03 - 13:14 Post subject:
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Depending on how much cash you have to throw around, it's better to have seperate amps for the different range of speakers you have, so you can tweak them out for optimal performance. You can use one multi-channel amp to power all your speakers just fine though.
One thing you need to make sure of is that you have good balance of speakers. Most people just get the 10's to cover the low-mids and lower frequencies and they don't always come out sounding very clean.
The set up that you're currently looking at seems fine except I would add a 12 for low low frequencies..but it's all a matter of how much space you want to comprimise etc..
Building a custom box would definitely be the best way to optimize your sound. There's some tips to that trade you should know about before attempting to build one though, things including; positioning and spacing, materials etc...
I don't really know much about all those technicalities, but I have seen diagrams and shizzle on the internet explaining the ohms and wattage, and all the other good stuff. I think they even had diagrams for custom designs for exact car models. 
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Paco
RealPoor Jedi
Joined: 13 Oct 2002
Posts: 12939
Location: Jacksonville, FL
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Posted: 10/13/03 - 13:26 Post subject:
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xarp posted pics of his on r00t's ftp, hehe, check em out you turd
unless r00t killed em, hehe
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Valik1
Luke Warm
Joined: 04 Nov 2002
Posts: 100
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Posted: 10/13/03 - 14:03 Post subject:
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xarp your coming to toronto for school? we must go drinking with zrazzt!
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Xarpolis
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 15 Oct 2002
Posts: 2884
Location: Philly, PA
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Posted: 10/13/03 - 15:26 Post subject:
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yeah Valik, I'm going to be living WITH zra for the 2 months I'm there. And Potsnu is talking about coming out to hang with us as well, a little bit.
I'm leaving to drive up the 27th of this month (a monday), and I'll be doing my long drive home on December 20th... so yeah, I'll be there a good while.
As far as my car sterio, I have some pictures now. and how I built my box. lemme see if I can find them...
PS: Please note that the box pretty much isn't all that good. I built it to the spec's that Rockford suggested in terms of volume, but there are ways to really bring out your sound. Different ways to chamber it and all that jazz. Stuff that I have yet to learn (but will learn while I'm in school)
Anyway... let's see.
Head Unit - Pioneer DEH-P7400
Driver's Tweeter - Part of my Infinity Kappa 60.5cs setup
Passenger Tweeter - Setup also includes 2 6 1/2" round loudspeakers
Phoenix Gold EQ232 & the sliding shelf I made for it.
the EQ hidden under my seat
Inner cabin speaker amp - Sony XM-460GTX (60x4 amp). I have the seat pulled as far foward as it would go so you can see it. Normally it's completely hidden
Here's my sub's & the box I built. I don't like how I built the box, so I'll be redesigning it while I'm up at the school. The subs are two 12" Rockford Fosgate RFD2212's.
Ok, and this is what my system looks like from the trunk. It's pretty damn messy. I hope to clean this up (A LOT!) while I'm away at school as well. as part of the new box design.
What you're seeing on the rear of the box is as followed.
Sony XM-D1000PS (900x1 amp for the subs), a Phoenix Gold Tantrum X2 crossover set to get the perfect tuning, and a Rockford Fosgate 1 farad digital capasitor.
Also in my car are 2 3 way 6x9's. Infinity Kappa 693.5i's I didn't take a picture of them 'cause you can't really see them at all.
What I'm looking to do now (or in the near future) is upgrade my Alternator as well as get a higher powered battery. Right now, my car just isn't creating enough power to handle the system and still do easy tasks like... using the power windows. also, the headlights still dim when the subs hit. I'm thinking an Alternator somewhere in the ballpark of 200 amps would do the trick. I'll see what I can come up with later.
As far as the pictures I took from when I built my own box, they were deleted. Lemme see if I still have them, and I'll upload them if I do.
Ok, here we go. It's in the "Uploads" folder. file name is "Xarp's 2 Sub Box.zip"
enjoy
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Valik1
Luke Warm
Joined: 04 Nov 2002
Posts: 100
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Posted: 10/13/03 - 16:15 Post subject:
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didnt look that messy dude you havei t mounted to the back of your box, all you have to do is route the wires along the bottum/top and itl be fine. if your building a new box though you might want to take into consideration making a lip you can channel them through possibly, thats what i did when i built my buddies
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Spitulski
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 23 Nov 2002
Posts: 4344
Location: Washington
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Posted: 10/14/03 - 03:58 Post subject:
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Brutul - best friend's brother had two 12" flame baskets in his BMW, and though it was a really nice install, I didn't like the way they sounded too much. They hit really really nicely, but what I'm looking for is the smoothest, fastest transition between hz at a decent SPL. I really don't want to bump hard most of the time - if I could replicate the sound of my home system's THX subs in a car environment, I'd be set.
Xarp - that phoenix installation looks f*****g tight. How much does that EQ run and where can I find one? Couldn't find the .zip in Uploads, btw =(.
What would be the benefit of getting a 12" W7 instead of a 10? Is the bass noticeably less defined, or is there just a good amount more punch with the definition? And would the 500/1 work with that or should I look at a higher power amp if I'm adding the two inches?
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Xarpolis
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 15 Oct 2002
Posts: 2884
Location: Philly, PA
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Posted: 10/14/03 - 05:48 Post subject:
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Well, to start, the 12" w7 is a w***e on power. it's needing 50% more than a 10". As far as the sound goes, sure it'll create a "deeper" rumble, but the average THX theater system is only using 10" subs in their enclosure anyway.
Oh, the other thing is price. You take a $250 jump when you go from a 10" to a 12" w/ the w7. Not to mention the different amp you'd have to go for.
If you're looking for very tight sq base, a 10" is your answer. if you want to annoy the neighbors... that's when you go for 12's or 15's.
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Spitulski
RealPoor Guru
Joined: 23 Nov 2002
Posts: 4344
Location: Washington
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Posted: 10/14/03 - 06:14 Post subject:
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Good to hear, I found a nice price on a 10 w7, but you're dead on about the price jump - $249.99.
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